Titus Livius (Livy) Ab urbe condita 28.43

When Fabius by a speech adapted to the situation, but especially by his prestige and long-established reputation for foresight, had stirred a large part of the senate and in particular the older members, and while more were praising the wisdom of the veteran than the confident spirit of the young man, Scipio is said to have spoken as follows:

[2] "Even Quintus Fabius himself at the beginning of his speech, conscript fathers, stated that in his expression of opinion captious criticism might be suspected.

[3] Far as I should be from venturing to bring that charge against so great a man, nevertheless such suspicion has certainly not been cleared away, be it the speech or the subject that is at fault.

[4] For he has highly extolled his offices and the fame of his achievements in order to refute the charge of envy, just as if it were ¹ from men of the lowest rank that there is danger of rivalry for me, and not rather from one who because he rises above all others —a distinction towards which I do not deny that I also am striving —is unwilling to have me compared with himself.

[5] He has represented himself as an old man and one who has played his part, and me as younger even than his son, just as if the desire for glory

[6] did not reach farther than the span of human life and project in fullest measure into the memory of posterity.

[7] Of the greatest minds it is true, I am sure, that they compare themselves not only with the living but with eminent men in every age. For my part I do not deny, Quintus Fabius, that I wish not only to attain to your fame but also —by your good leave —if possible to surpass it.

[8] Let us not have such a spirit —you towards me, I towards younger men — that we should be unwilling to have any fellowcitizen come to be like us. For that would be a loss affecting, not only those whom we have envied, but the state also and almost the entire human race.

[9] "He called to mind how great a danger I should encounter if I were to cross over to Africa, so that he seemed concerned for me also, not merely for the state and the army.

[10] Whence has come this sudden solicitude about me? When my father and uncle had been slain, when their two armies had been all but annihilated, when the Spanish provinces had been lost, when four armies of Carthaginians and four

[11] generals held the whole country in the grip of fear and arms, when, though sought for, no commanding general presented himself for that war except myself, no one had dared to put forward his name, when the Roman people had bestowed upon me at the age of ² twenty-four years its high command, why in such circumstances did no one at that time call to

[12] mind my youth, the might of the enemy, the difficulty of the war, the recent disaster to my father and my uncle?

[13] Has some greater catastrophe now befallen us in Africa than had been suffered then in Spain? Or are there now larger armies in Africa and more generals and better than there were then in Spain? Or was my age then riper for the conduct of war than it is now?

[14] Or is it more suitable to wage war with a Carthaginian enemy in Spain than in Africa?

[15] It is easy to disparage my achievements after the rout and flight of four Punic armies, after the storming of so many cities or their subjugation through fear, after a thorough and complete conquest all the way to the Ocean —so many princes, so many warlike nations — after the recovery of all Spain so that no trace of war remains.

[16] It will indeed be just as easy if I return as a victor from Africa to disparage precisely the same things which now, in order to hold me back, are magnified by the speaker to make them appear terrible.

"He denies that we have any access to Africa, he denies that any harbours are open to us.

[17] He states that Marcus Atilius was captured in Africa, as if Marcus Atilius met disaster upon his first landing in Africa. Also he does not recall that even that unfortunate general found the harbours of Africa nevertheless open to him and conducted a remarkable campaign in his first year, and so far as Carthaginian generals are concerned, ³ remained undefeated to the end. You shall not frighten me, therefore, by the example you give.

[18] If that disaster had been incurred in this war, not in the former war, if recently and not forty years ago, ⁴ why after Regulus' capture should I ⁵ hesitate to cross over to Africa any more than to Spain after the Scipios had fallen?

[19] I should not admit that the Spartan Xanthippus' ⁶ birth had been more fortunate for Carthage than mine for my native city; and my confidence would be increased by the mere possibility of such weight in the ability of a single man.

[20] But we must hear likewise of the Athenians, how neglecting a war at home they crossed rashly to Sicily.

[21] Why then, since you have time to tell Greek tales, do you not prefer to relate how Agathocles, ⁷ King of Syracuse, after Sicily had long been ablaze with a Punic war, crossed over into this same Africa and diverted the war to the country from which it had come?

Fabius having made a strong impression on a large portion of the senate, and especially those advanced in years, by this speech, which was adapted to the occasion, and also by his authority and his long-established reputation for prudence; and those who approved of the counsel of this old man being more numerous than those who commended the hot spirit of the young one;

[2] Scipio is reported thus to have spoken:

[3] "Even Quintus Fabius himself has observed, conscript fathers, in the commencement of his speech, that in the opinion he gave a feeling of jealousy might be suspected.

[4] And though I dare not myself charge so great a man with harbouring that feeling, yet, whether it is owing to a defect in his language, or to the fact, that suspicion has certainly not been removed. For he has so magnified his own honours and the fame of his exploits, in order to do away with the imputation of envy, that it would appear I am in danger of being rivalled by every obscure person, but not by himself, because, as he enjoys an eminence above every body else, an eminence to which I do not dissemble that I also aspire, he is unwilling that I should be placed upon a level with him.

[5] He has represented himself as an old man, and as one who has gone through every gradation of honour, and me as below the age even of his son;

[6] as if he supposed that the desire of glory did not exceed the limits of human life, and as if its chief part had not respect to memory and future ages.

[7] I am confident, that it is usual with all the most exalted minds, to compare themselves, not only with the illustrious men of the present, but of every age.

[8] For my own part, I do not dissemble that I am desirous, not only to attain to the share of glory which you possess, Quintus Fabius, but, (and in saying it I mean no offence,) if I can, even to exceed it. Let not such a feeling exist in your mind towards me, nor in mine towards those who are my juniors, as that we should be unwilling that any of our countrymen should attain to the same celebrity with ourselves;

[9] for that would be a detriment, not to those only who may be the objects of our envy, but to the state, and almost to the whole human race.

[10] He mentioned what a great degree of danger I should incur, should I cross over into Africa, so that he appeared solicitous on my account, and not only for the state and the army. But whence has this concern for me so suddenly sprung?

[11] When my father and uncle were slain; when their two armies were cut up almost to a man; when Spain was lost; when four armies of the Carthaginians and four generals kept possession of every thing by terror and by arms; when a general was sought for to take the command of that war, and no one came forward besides myself, no one had the courage to declare himself a candidate; when the Roman people had conferred the command upon me, though only twenty-four years of age;

[12] why was it that no one at that time made any mention of my age, of the strength of the enemy, of the difficulty of the war, and of the recent destruction of my father and uncle?

[13] Has some greater disaster been suffered in Africa now than had at that time befallen us in Spain? Are there now larger armies in Africa, more and better generals, than were then in Spain?

[14] Was my age then more mature for conducting a war than now? Can a war with a Carthaginian enemy be carried on with greater convenience in Spain than in Africa?

[15] After having routed and put to flight four Carthaginian armies; after having captured by force, or reduced to submission by fear, so many cities; after having entirely subdued every thing as far as the ocean, so many petty princes, so many savage nations; after having regained possession of the whole of Spain, so that no trace of war remains, it is an easy matter to make light of my services;

[16] just as easy as it would be, should I return victorious from Africa, to make light of those very circumstances which are now magnified in order that they may appear formidable, for the purpose of detaining me here. He says that there is no possibility of entering Africa; that there are no ports open.

[17] He mentions that Marcus Atilius was taken prisoner in Africa, as if Marcus Atilius had miscarried on his first access to Africa. Nor does he recollect that the ports of Africa were open to that very commander, unfortunate as he was; that he performed some brilliant services during the first year, and continued undefeated to the last, so far as related to the Carthaginian generals. You will not, therefore, in the least deter me by that example of yours.

[18] If that disaster had been sustained in the present, and not in the former war, if lately, and not forty years ago, yet why would it be less advisable for me to cross over into Africa after Regulus had been made prisoner there, than into Spain after the Scipios had been slain there?

[19] I should be reluctant to admit that the birth of Xanthippus the Lacedaemonian was more fortunate for Carthage than mine for my country. My confidence would be increased by the very circumstance, that such important consequences depended upon the valour of one man.

[20] But further, we must take warning by the Athenians, who inconsiderately crossed over into Sicily, leaving a war in their own country.

[21] Why, therefore, since you have leisure to relate Grecian tales, do you not rather set before us the instance of Agathocles, king of Syracuse, who, when Sicily was for a long time wasted by a Punic war, by passing over into this same Africa, removed the war to the country from whence it came.

This speech of Fabius, so appropriate to the circumstances under which it was delivered, and backed up by the weight of his character and his long-established reputation for prudence, produced a great effect upon most of those present, especially upon the seniors. Seeing that the majority approved of the sage counsels of age in preference to the impetuous temper of youth, Scipio is reported to have made the following reply: "Senators, at the beginning of his speech, Q. Fabius admitted that what he had to say might lay him under a suspicion of jealousy.

[2] Personally, I should not dare to accuse so great a man of that weakness, but either through the inadequacy of his defence or the impossibility of making a successful one, he has utterly failed to clear himself of the charge.

[3] For in his anxiety to dispel the suspicion, he spoke about his distinctions and his reputation in such exaggerated terms as to give the impression that I was in danger of finding a rival in the lowest of the Romans, not in him who, because he stands above all others-a position which I frankly confess I am striving to attain, denies the possibility of any rivalry between us.

[4] He has represented himself as an old man full of honours, and me as a youth not even as old as his son, as if the passion for glory did not extend beyond the span of human life and find its chief satisfaction in the memory of future generations. I am quite certain that it is the lot of all great men to compare themselves not with their contemporaries alone, but also with the illustrious of all ages.

[5] I admit, Quintus Fabius, that I am desirous not only of equalling your renown but-forgive my saying so-of surpassing it, if I can. Let not your feeling towards me, or mine towards my juniors, be such that we would prevent any of our fellow-citizens from reaching our level. That would not only injure the victims of our envy, it would be a loss to the State, and almost to the human race.

[6] "The speaker dwelt upon the danger to which I should be exposed if I landed in Africa, showing apparently solicitude not only for the commonwealth and its army but even for me. What has led to this sudden anxiety on my account?

[7] When my father and my uncle were killed and their armies all but annihilated; when Spain was lost; when four Carthaginian armies and their generals were holding the whole country down by the terror of their arms; when you were looking for a man to take the supreme command in that war and no one appeared, no one came forward to offer himself but me; when the Roman people conferred the supreme command on me before I had reached my twenty-fifth year-why did no one then say anything about my age, the strength of the enemy, the difficulties of the campaign or the recent disaster which had overtaken my father and my uncle?

[8] Has some calamity occurred recently in Africa greater than the one which happened then in Spain? Are there larger armies and better and more numerous commanders in Africa now than there were then in Spain? Was I then at a riper age for undertaking a great war than I am today? Is Spain a more convenient field for operations against the Carthaginians than Africa?

[9] Now that I have scattered four Carthaginian armies in flight, reduced so many cities by force or fear, and subjugated every part down to the shores of the ocean, petty kings and savage tribes alike; now that I have reconquered the whole of Spain so completely that no vestige of war anywhere remains, it is an easy task to make light of my services, as easy, in fact, as it will be, when I have returned victorious from Africa, to make light of those very difficulties which are now painted in such dark colours in order to keep me here.

[10] "Fabius says that no part of Africa is accessible, that there are no harbours open to us. He tells us that M. Atilius Regulus was made prisoner in Africa, as though he had met with misfortune as soon as he landed. He forgets that that very commander, unfortunate as he was afterwards, did find some harbours in Africa open to him, and for the first twelve months won some brilliant victories, and as far as the Carthaginian generals were concerned, remained undefeated to the last. You will not, therefore, deter me by quoting that instance. Even if that disaster had occurred in this war instead of in the last one, quite recently and not forty years ago-even then why should I be prevented from invading Africa because Regulus was made prisoner any more than I was prevented from going to Spain after the two Scipios were killed?

[11] I should be sorry to believe that Xanthippus, the Lacedaemonian, was born to be a greater blessing to Carthage than I am to be to my country, and my confidence is strengthened by seeing what tremendous issues depend upon one man's courage. We have had to listen even to stories about the Athenians, how they neglected the war at their doors in order to go to Sicily.

[12] Well, since you are at leisure to tell us tales about Greece why do you not mention Agathocles, king of Syracuse, who after Sicily had long been wasted by the flames of the Punic War sailed across to this same Africa and turned the tide of war back to the country from which it had started?"