Thucydides History of the Peloponnesian War 3.38

[1] "For my own part, I am of the opinion I was before; and I wonder at these men that have brought this matter of the Mytilenaeans in question again and thereby caused delay, which is the advantage only of them that do the injury. For the sufferer by this means comes upon the doer with his anger dulled; whereas revenge, the opposite of injury, is then greatest when it follows presently. I do wonder also what he is that shall stand up now to contradict me and shall think to prove that the injuries done us by the Mytilenaeans are good for us or that our calamities are any damage to our confederates.

[2] For certainly he must either trust in his eloquence to make you believe that that which was decreed was not decreed or, moved with lucre, must with some elaborate speech endeavour to seduce you. Now of such matches [of eloquence] as these, the city giveth the prizes to others;

[3] but the danger that hence proceedeth, she herself sustaineth.

[4] And of all this you yourselves are the cause, by the evil institution of these matches, in that you use to be spectators of words and hearers of actions, beholding future actions in the words of them that speak well as possible to come to pass and actions already past in the orations of such as make the most of them, and that with such assurance, as if what you saw with your eyes were not more certain than what you hear related.

[5] You are excellent men for one to deceive with a speech of a new strain but backward to follow any tried advice, slaves to strange things, contemners of things usual. You would everyone chiefly give the best advice;

[6] but if you cannot, then you will contradict those that do. You would not be thought to come after with your opinion but rather, if anything be acutely spoken, to applaud it first and to appear ready apprehenders of what is spoken even before it be out, but slow to preconceive the sequel of the same. You would hear, as one may say, somewhat else than what our life is conversant in;

[7] and yet you sufficiently understand not that that is before your eyes. And to speak plainly, overcome with the delight of the ear, you are rather like unto spectators sitting to hear the contentions of sophisters than to men that deliberate of the state of a commonwealth.

[1] For myself, I adhere to my former opinion, and wonder at those who have proposed to reopen the case of the Mitylenians, and who are thus causing a delay which is all in favour of the guilty, by making the sufferer proceed against the offender with the edge of his anger blunted; although where vengeance follows most closely upon the wrong, it best equals it and most amply requites it. I wonder also who will be the man who will maintain the contrary, and will pretend to show that the crimes of the Mitylenians are of service to us, and our misfortunes injurious to the allies.

[2] Such a man must plainly either have such confidence in his rhetoric as to adventure to prove that what has been once for all decided is still undetermined, or be bribed to try to delude us by elaborate sophisms.

[3] In such contests the state gives the rewards to others, and takes the dangers for herself.

[4] The persons to blame are you who are so foolish as to institute these contests; who go to see an oration as you would to see a sight, take your facts on hearsay, judge of the practicability of a project by the wit of its advocates, and trust for the truth as to past events not to the fact which you saw more than to the clever strictures which you heard;

[5] the easy victims of newfangled arguments, unwilling to follow received conclusions; slaves to every new paradox, despisers of the commonplace;

[6] the first wish of every man being that he could speak himself, the next to rival those who can speak by seeming to be quite up with their ideas by applauding every hit almost before it is made, and by being as quick in catching an argument as you are slow in foreseeing its consequences;

[7] asking, if I may so say, for something different from the conditions under which we live, and yet comprehending inadequately those very conditions; very slaves to the pleasure of the ear, and more like the audience of a rhetorician than the council of a city.

,Ich meines Theils bleibe bei meiner Meinung, und kann ^{1 2}
mich nur wundern über die, welche die Angelegenheit der Mytilenäer
noch einmal zur Sprache bringen und damit einen Zeitverlust
herbeiführen, der nur den Schuldigen zu Gute kommt. Denn dadurch wird
nur der Zorneifer abgeschwächt, mit welchem der Beschädigte gegen
den Schädiger vorgehen sollte, während doch nur die Rache, die der
Beleidigung aus dem Fuße folgt, mit gleicher Wage die gerechte
Wiedervergeltung übt. Es soll mich aber auch wundern, wer mir hierin
zu widersprechen sich herausnehmen wird, und zu beweisen, daß die
Verbrechen der Mytilenäer für-uns nutzbringend seien, unser Vortheil
aber für die Bundesgenossen Nachtheil einschließe. Ein solcher müßte
doch im Vertrauen auf seine Rednergabe den Gegenbeweis zu führen
streben, nicht das Allgemein Anerkannte sei zum Beschlusse erhoben
worden, oder er müßte durch Geld bestochen sein, euch durch
Redekunst, die den Schein der Wahrheit borgt, hinter's Licht zu führen.
Der Staat aber läßt die Siegespreise solcher Wettkämpfe Andern
zukommen ; er selbst behält nur die Gefahren für sich. Und die Schuld
hiervon tragt ihr, als schlechte Kampfrichter, denn euer Augenmerk
richtet ihr nur auf die Reden, die Thatsachen aber hört ihr nur so
nebenher mit an, und künftige Unternehmungen beurtheilt ihr nach denen,
die schöne Worte darüber machen, wie leicht sie auszuführen seien, —
was aber bereits geschehen ist, nach denen, die mit schönen Worten
Ausstellungen zu machen wissen: nnd ihr solltet doch bedenken, daß
man sich bei geschehenen Dingen besser auf seine eigenen Augen
verläßt , als auf fremdes Gerede. Durch unerwartete Neuheit der Rede
euch hinter's Licht führen zu lassen, versteht ihr vortrefflich, und
ebenso auch, der überzeugenden Bewährtheit eines Vorschlags eure
Ohren zu verschließen; denn ihr seid Sklaven des Außerordentlichen
und Verächter des Gewöhnlichen. Jeder will nur selbst zum Reden
kommen, und wenn nicht das, so doch mit denen, die solcherlei
vortragen, wie im Wettkampf ringen, um den Schein zu vermeiden, als
käme seine eigene Einsicht nur so hinterdrein, oder auch um schnell
noch die eigene Ansicht auszusprechen, bevor jener noch geredet. Ihr
seid ebenso flink, voraus zu errathen, was gesagt werden wird, als
schwerfällig, die Folgen desselben vorauszusehen. Ihr sucht, so zu
sagen, ganz andere Dinge herbeizuführen als die Zustände, in denen
wir leben, und seid doch nicht einmal im Stande, die gegenwärtige
Lage vernünftig zn beurtheilen, und kurz, ihr seid immer Sklaven ³
des Ohrenkitzels, und ihr gleicht eher den müsftgen Gaffern auf den
Bänken der Sophisten 26), als Männern, die über das Staatswohl
berathen."

XXXVIII. « Pour moi, je persiste dans mon opinion : j’admire vraiment ceux qui viennent vous proposer une nouvelle délibération au sujet des Mytiléniens, et vous faire perdre du temps. Les coupables surtout ont à y gagner ; car la colère de l’offensé contre l’agresseur finit par s’émousser, mais lorsque la répression suit de près l’injure, elle ne lui cède en rien, et la vengeance est entière. Un autre sujet d’étonnement pour moi c’est que quelqu’un ose me contredire, et prétende démontrer que nous gagnons aux attentats des Mytiléniens et que les allié sau contraire perdent à nos revers. Sans doute, confiant dans son éloquence, il argumentera pour prouver que ce qui est résolu ne l’est pas, ou bien, exalté par le profit qu’il en attend, il travaillera un discours spécieux pour vous égarer. En attendant, c’est la répu- blique qui paye le prix des combats de ce genre, et elle n’y gagne pour elle-même que des dangers. La faute en est à vous, à la légèreté de vos décisions dans ces sortes de joutes : car il est dans vos habitudes d’être spectateurs des discours et auditeurs des actions ; vous jugez de la possibilité des événements à venir sur les belles paroles d’un orateur ; et, pour les faits déjà accomplis, vous accordez moins de confiance à ce qui s’est passé sous vos yeux qu’à ce qui vous est raconté par un discoureur habile à farder agréablement la vérité. Vous excellez à vous laisser tromper par la nouveauté des discours, et vous ne savez jamais suivre une résolution adoptée. Esclaves en tout de l’extraordinaire, dédaigneux de ce qui est habituel, chacun de vous prétend avoir le don de la parole ; sinon, il contrarie ceux qui possèdent, pour ne pas avoir l’air de suivre l’opinion d’un autre ; chacun veut être le premier à louer une pensée piquante. Aussi prompts à deviner à l’avance ce qu’on va vous dire, que lents à en prévoir les conséquences, vous êtes à la recherche, en quelque sorte, de ce qui n’est pas du monde où nous vivons, et vous ne savez pas même juger sainement de ce qui est sous vos yeux. Enfin, dominés entièrement par le plaisir de l’oreille, vous ressemblez plutôt à des spectateurs assis pour entendre des sophistes, qu’à des citoyens délibérant sur les intérêts de l’État.

« Pour moi, je suis toujours le même. Je m’étonne qu’on ait remis en discussion l’affaire des Mytiléniens et provoqué des atermoiements qui sont tout en faveur des coupables. La colère de l’offensé contre l’offenseur va en s’amortissant; mais, quand la répression suit immédiatement l’outrage, la balance est égale et la vengeance complète.

« Je serais curieux de savoir qui osera me contredire et soutenir que les.crimes des Mytiléniens nous sont utiles, ou nos revers préjudiciables à nos alliés. Évidemment, à grand renfort de sophismes, il s’évertuera pour établir que ce qui a été voté ne l’a pas été; ou, séduit par l’appât du gain, il essayera, par un discours captieux, de vous faire prendre le change. Par malheur, dans ces sortes de luttes, c’est à d’autres que la ville décerne les prix; pour elle, elle ne se réserve que les dangers.

« La faute en est à vous, qui présidez mal aux débats ; à vous, qui vous posez en spectateurs des paroles et en auditeurs des actions. Vous jugez des éventualités futures d’après le dire des beaux parleurs. Pour les faits accomplis, vous en croyez moins vos yeux que vos oreilles, parce que vous êtes éblouis par le prestige de l’éloquence. Éternellement dupes de la nouveauté des discours, vous refusez de suivre une parole éprouvée. Esclaves de ce, qui est étrange, dédaigneux de ce qui est connu, vous aspirez tous au talent oratoire ; et, si vou§ ne pouvez y parvenir, vous prenez le contre-pied de ceux qui le possèdent, afin de n’ayoir pas l’air de vous mettre à la remorque d’une opinion, mais d’être les premiers à applaudir à une saillie. Prompts à courir au-devant des paroles, lents à prévoir les résultats ; cherchant je ne sais quel monde imaginaire, sans jamais vous inquiéter de la réalité ; en un mot, fascinés par le plaisir de Touïe, et plus semblables à des auditeurs de sophistes qu’à des citoyens délibérant sur les intérêts de l’État.

[1] "As for me, I have not changed my opinion, and I wonder at those who propose to debate again the question of the Mytilenaeans and thus interpose delay, which is in the interest of those who have done the wrong; for thus the edge of the victim's wrath is duller when he proceeds against the offender, whereas the vengeance that follows upon the very heels of the outrage exacts a punishment that most nearly matches the offence. And I wonder, too, who will answer me and undertake to prove that the wrong-doings of the Mytilenaeans are beneficial to us but that our misfortunes prove injurious to our allies.

[2] Manifestly he must either have such confidence in his powers of speech as to undertake to show that what is universally accepted as true has not been established, ¹ or else, incited by gain, will by an elaborate display of specious oratory attempt to mislead you.

[3] But in contests of that kind the city bestows the prizes upon others, while she herself undergoes all the risks. And you are yourselves to blame, for your management of these contests is wrong.

[4] It is your wont to be spectators of words and hearers of deeds, forming your judgment of future enterprises according as able speakers represent them to be feasible, but as regards accomplished facts, not counting what has been done more credible, because you have seen it, than what you have heard, you are swayed in judgment by those who have made an eloquent invective.

[5] You are adepts not only at being deceived by novel proposals but also at refusing to follow approved advice, slaves as you are of each new paradox and scorners of what is familiar.

[6] Each of you wishes above all to be an orator himself, or, failing that, to vie with those dealers in paradox by seeming not to lag behind them in wit but to applaud a smart saying before it is out of the speaker's mouth; you are as quick to forestall what is said as you are slow to foresee what will come of it.

[7] You seek, one might say, a world quite unlike that in which we live, but give too little heed to that which is at hand. In a word, you are in thrall to the pleasures of the ear and are more like men who sit as spectators at exhibitions of sophists than men who take counsel for the welfare of the state.

[1] "I, then, continue of the same opinion; and am astonished at those who have proposed to discuss a second time the case of the Mytilenaeans, and caused in it a delay of time, which is all for the advantage of the guilty (for so the sufferer proceeds against the offender with his anger less keen; whereas when retribution treads most closely on the heels of suffering, it best matches it in wreaking vengeance). I wonder, too, who will be the man to maintain the opposite opinion, and to pretend to show that the injuries done by the Mytilenaeans are beneficial to us, and that our misfortunes are losses to our allies. It is evident that either trusting to his eloquence he would strive to prove, in opposition to us, that what we consider most certain has not been ascertained;

[2] or, urged on by the hope of gain, will endeavour to lead us away by an elaborate display of specious language. But in such contests as these the state gives the prizes to others, and takes only the dangers itself.

[3] And it is you who are to blame for it, through unwisely instituting these contests;

[4] inasmuch as you are accustomed to attend to speeches like spectators [in a theatre], and to facts like mere listeners [to what others tell you]; with regard to things future, judging of their possibility from those who have spoken cleverly about them; and with regard to things which have already occurred, not taking what has been done as more credible from your having seen it, than what has been only heard from those who in words have delivered a clever invective.

[5] And so you are the best men to be imposed on with novelty of argument, and to be unwilling to follow up what has been approved by you; being slaves to every new paradox, and despisers of what is ordinary. Each of you wishes, above all, to be able to speak himself;

[6] but if that is not possible, in rivalry of those who so speak, you strive not to appear to have followed his sentiments at second-hand; but when he has said any thing cleverly, you would fain appear to have anticipated its expression by your applause, and are eager to catch beforehand what is said, and at the same time slow to foresee the consequences of it.

[7] Thus you look, so to speak, for something different from the circumstances in which we are actually living; while you have not a sufficient understanding of even that which is before you. In a word, you are overpowered by the pleasures of the ear, and are like men sitting to ¹ be amused by rhetoricians rather than deliberating upon state affairs.

[1] « Itaque ego quidem permaneo in eadem sententia , atque illos miror, qui de Mytilenaeis ad vos Herum retulerunt, et moram interposuerunt, quod id magis e re illorum est, qqi injuriam fecerunt, (qui enim injuriam accepit,eum, qui fecit, ira languidiore persequitur, defensio autem, quae injuriae illatae, si quam proxime jungitur, pari vi occurnt, optime poenam repetit); miror etiam, quis ille futurus sit, qui contra dicet et sustinebit pronuntiare Mytilenaeorum quidem injurias esse uobis utiles, nostros vero casus sociis detrimenta afferre.

[2] Atque manifesto is ant dicendi facultate fretus hoc contendet, ut quod maxime placebat, contra demonstret decretum non esse, aut quaestu inductus speciosa oratione elaborata imponere vobis conabitur.

At respublica ab hujusmodi certaminibus praemia quidem aliis dat, ipsa vero pericula sustinet.

[4] Culpa autem hujus rei penes vos est, eo quod malos vos arbitros certaminum praebetis, quippe qui consuestis verborum quidem spectatores, rerum gestarum vero auditores esse, res quidem futuras pro eo, ut quis optime dixerit, posse fieri aestimantes, de gestis vero rebus non ei, quod actum est et quod oculis i videtis, majorem fidem habentes, quam ei, quod auditum est, ab orationibus pendentes, quae pulchre indignationem commoverint ;

[5] et novitatem quidem orationis si quis afferat, facillime vobis imponi sinitis, si vero sobriam rerum aestimationem, nullo modo sequi vultis, quippe servi semper rerum inusitatarum, contemptores vero consuetarum,

[6] et potissimum quidem cupientes singuli pro se quisque posse de rebus publicis agere, sin minus, resistendo certe illis, qui hac laude excellunt, non tardiores videri illoruiu sententiam assecutos esse, sed si quis aliquid acute dicat, id jam ante comprobasse, et simul ad ea quae dicuntur, ante intelligenda promptos esse, et tardos ad providenda ea, quae ex his eventura sunt;

[7] quippe desiderantes semper aliud quid, ut ita dicam, quam ea, in quibus vivimus , aestimantes autem ne de praesentibus quidem rebus satis recte; proinde denique aurium voluptati dediti et potius similes iis, qui sophistarum spectatores sedent, quam qui de republica consultant.

[1] Und wo ist für die Erholung des Gemüthes nach der Arbeit reichlicher gesorgt als bei uns, wo Kampfspiele und Feste in steter Folge sich ablösen, und die geschmackvolle Einrichtung des Hauses das Herz täglich aufs neue zum Frohsinn stimmt?

« Io pertanto sono sempre della medesima sentenza , e mi maraviglio di chi rimette in quistione l’affare dei Mitilenei e vi procura indugi, i quali sono piuttosto a vantaggio dell’ ingiuriatole ; dappoiché in questo modo l’offeso perseguita l’offensore con men caldo sdegno ; dove la vendetta quanto più segue dappresso l’ingiuria, movendo da impeto eguale, ne prende in riscatto il più severo castigo. Mi maraviglio inoltre di chiunque sarà per contradirmi , e pretenderà di dichiarare essere di nostra utilità i torti fattici dai Mitilenei, e ridondare a danno degli alleati i nostri vantaggi : bene è chiaro che costui, o affidato alle sue parole , vorrà ingegnarsi di mostrare ad onta mia che una formale risoluzione non è uu decreto, o incitato da guadagno si sforzerà di sedurvi colla speziosità di elaborato discorso. Intanto la Repubblica con questi politici certami dà la palma ad altri, e viene ella stessa in pericolò. Ma la colpa è di voi che guastate di tali gare la forma ; voi che solete sedervi spettatori delle parole e uditori dei falli ; voi che le cose avvenire risguardate come possibili ad accadere per i discorsi de’ bei dicitori ; e quanto alle passate , più fidanza ponete non in ciò che vedesle co’ propri occhi vostri, ma in ciò che udiste per la bocca di coloro che di buon garbo vi rampognano. Bravissimi a lasciarvi gabbare dalla novità d’un discorso, non a seguir quello che sia universalmente ricevuto ; schiavi sempre dello straordinario, e disprezzatori del consueto ; smaniosi ognuno d’esser tenuto valente parlatore, se non a segno di gareggiar con chi lo sia, almeno, per non parer d’andar dietro al sentimento d un altro, anticipar la lodo a chi sia per dire qualche cosa di ingegnoso ; prontissimi a indovinare la mente di chi parla, ma tardi a prevedere le conseguenze ; gente che cercate uno stato di cose opposto, per cqsì dire, a quello in che viviamo; discernitori mal atti del presente; insomma, schiavi del diletico dell’orecchio ; sembianti a chi segga spettatore di garruli maestruzzi, più presto che a chi deliberi intorno alla salute della patria.