Thucydides, History of the Peloponnesian War, Adolf Wahrmund (Translator), 5.86

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„Daß ihr durch eure Nachgiebigkeit es möglich gemacht
habt, uns gegenseitig in Ruhe zu belehren,' kann nicht getadelt
werden. Im Widerspruch damit aber stehen die kriegerischen.Anstalten,
die-ihr bereits, schon getroffen habt und nicht erst von der Zukunft
abhängig machen wollt. Wir sehen, daß ihr.gekommen- seid, um über
das, was wir vorbringen werden,-selbst als Richter zu entscheiden;
und das, Ende davon wird sein, daß ihr uns den Krieg bringt, wenn
uvir — wie natürlich in Vertretung unseres Rechtes hie obsiegen
und eben, deßhalb auch nicht nachgeben' wollen,— lassen, wir, euch
aber das Recht.-iso,bringt ihr.uns.Knehctschaft." v . '

History of the Peloponnesian War. Thucydides. Adolf Wahrmund (Translator). Stuttgart. 1864.

Current edition First1KGreek

Geschichte des Peloponnesischen Kriegs (German) (Thucydides. Geschichte des Peloponnesischen Kriegs. Wahrmund, Adolf, translator. Stuttgart: Krais and Hoffmann, 1864.)

Editions (1)

Ἱστορίαι Perseus (Thucydides. Historiae, Vol 1-2. Jones, Henry Stuart, editor. Oxford: Oxford University Press, 1910. (1942 printing).) — 5.86.1 focus

[1] οἱ δὲ τῶν Μηλίων ξύνεδροι ἀπεκρίναντο ‘ἡ μὲν ἐπιείκεια τοῦ διδάσκειν καθ’ ἡσυχίαν ἀλλήλους οὐ ψέγεται, τὰ δὲ τοῦ πολέμου παρόντα ἤδη καὶ οὐ μέλλοντα διαφέροντα αὐτοῦ φαίνεται. ὁρῶμεν γὰρ αὐτούς τε κριτὰς ἥκοντας ὑμᾶς τῶν λεχθησομένων καὶ τὴν τελευτὴν ἐξ αὐτοῦ κατὰ τὸ εἰκὸς περιγενομένοις μὲν τῷ δικαίῳ καὶ δι’ αὐτὸ μὴ ἐνδοῦσι πόλεμον ἡμῖν φέρουσαν, πεισθεῖσι δὲ δουλείαν.’

Translations (9)

The History of the Grecian War Perseus (Thucydides. The English works of Thomas Hobbes of Malmesbury. Hobbes, Thomas. translator. London: John Bohn, 1843.) — 5.86.1 focus

[1] Whereunto the council of the Melians answered: The equity of a leisurely debate is not to be found fault withal; but this preparation of war, not future but already here present, seemeth not to agree with the same. For we see that you are come to be judges of the conference, and that the issue of it, if we be superior in argument and therefore yield not, is likely to bring us war, and if we yield, servitude.

History of the Peloponnesian War Perseus (Thucydides. History of the Peloponnesian War. Crawley, Richard, translator. London and Toronto: J. M. Dent and Sons Ltd.; New York: E. P. Dutton and Co., 1914.) — 5.86.1 focus

The Melian commissioners answered:—

‘To the fairness of quietly instructing each other as you propose there is nothing to object; but your military preparations are too far advanced to agree with what you say, as we see you are come to be judges in your own cause, and that all we can reasonably expect from this negotiation is war, if we prove to have right on our side and refuse to submit, and in the contrary case, slavery.’

Geschichte des Peloponnesischen Kriegs First1KGreek (Thucydides. Geschichte des Peloponnesischen Kriegs. Braun, Theodor, translator. Leipzig: Insel-Verlag, 1917.) — 5.86 focus

Melier: „Gegen den zweckmäßigen Vorschlag, die Sache
ruhig miteinander zu besprechen, haben wir nichts zu erinnern.
Daß ihr uns aber so ohne weiteres gleich mit Krieg über
zieht, scheint sich damit denn doch nicht zu vertragen; denn
offenbar tretet ihr hier mit dem Anspruch auf, bei diesen Be
sprechungen das letzte Wort zu haben, und wenn wir dabei,
wie wahrscheinlich, recht behalten und deshalb nicht nachgeben,
so wird es für uns auf Krieg, wenn wir uns aber fügen,
auf Knechtschaft hinauskommen."

Histoire de la Guerre du Péloponèse First1KGreek (Thucydides. Histoire de la Guerre du Péloponnése, Vol. 1-2. Zévort, Marie Charles, translator. Paris: Charpentier, 1852.) — 5.86 focus

LXXXVI. L es M éliens. « On ne peut qu’approuver cette façon courtoise de s’éclairer mutuellement; mais les actes, les hostilités, non point imminentes, mais déjà commencées, ne semblent guère d'accord avec ces procédés; car nous voyons bien qu’en venant ici vous vous érigez juges de ce qui va se dire, et que dès lors il ne peut sortir pour nous de cette conférence que la guerre, si, forts de l’évidence de notre droit, nous refusons de céder, ou la servitude si nous nous rendons à vos raisons.

Histoire de la Guerre du Péloponnése First1KGreek (Thucydides. Histoire de la Guerre du Péloponnése. Bétant, Élie-Ami, translator. Paris: Librairie de L. Hachette, 1863.) — 5.86 focus

Les Méliens. Nous n’avons rien à objecter contre cette manière calme et modérée de s’éclairer mutuellement; cependant elle nous semble s’accorder mal avec la guerre qui nous menace, non dans un avenir éloigné, mais à l’instant même. Nous le voyons : vous vous posez en juges de nos paroles ; et l’issue probable de cette discussion sera pour nous la guerre, si, fondés sur le droit, nous refusons de céder, ou, dans le cas contraire, l’esclavage.

History of the Peloponnesian War First1KGreek (Thucydides, Vol. 1-4. Smith, Charles Foster, translator. London and Cambridge, MA: Heinemann and Harvard University Press, 1919-1923.) — 5.86.1 focus

[1] The commissioners of the Melians answered: “The fairness of the proposal, that we shall at our leisure instruct one another, is not open to objection, but these acts of war, which are not in the future, but already here at hand, are manifestly at variance with your suggestion. For we see that you are come to be yourselves judges of what is to be said here, and that the outcome of the discussion will in all likelihood be, if we win the debate by the righteousness of our cause and for that very reason refuse to yield, war for us, whereas if we are persuaded, servitude.”

History of the Peloponnesian War First1KGreek (Thucydides. The history of the Peloponnesian War, Volume 1-2. Dale, Henry, translator. London: Heinemann and Henry G. Bohn, 1851-1852.) — 5.86.1 focus

[1] Mel.

The fairness of thus calmly instructing each other is open to no objection: but your preparations for war, which are already here, and not merely coming, appear to be at variance with it. For we see that you are come to be yourselves judges of what will be said; and that the issue of the conference will in all probability bring us war, if we are stronger in the justice of our cause, and therefore refuse to submit; or slavery, if we are convinced by you.

Historia Belli Peloponnesiaci First1KGreek (Historia Belli Peloponnesiaci. Haase, Friedrich, translator. Paris: Firmin Didot, 1869.) — 5.86.1 focus

[1] Meliorum vero consessus respondit: « ./Equitas qn idem inter se per otium docendi non vituperatur, sed bellum quod jam praesens est et non futurum, ab hac re manifesto discrepat. Videmus enim et vos ipsos eorum, quae dicentur, judices venisse, et hujus colloquii exitum, si, ut par est, jure quidem vobis superiores fuerimus, et propterea vobis non cesserimus, bellum nobis allaturum, si vero obediamus, servitutem. »

La storia di Tucidide First1KGreek (Thucydides. Della storia di Tucidide volgarizzata libri otto. Anonymous translator. Florence: Tipografia Galileiana, 1835.) — 5.86 focus

Melii. « Da noi non si biasima l’amichevol maniera di chiarirsi quetamente l' un l' altro ; ma pare che non s’accordi con essa una guerra già presente e non in forse. Perocché vediamo voi stessi venir giudici delle cose che si diranno ; e vi è da aspettarsi che vincendovi iti ra- gione e per conseguente non cedendo, l' esito di questo colloquio ci apporti guerra ; e rimanendo noi convinti da voi, schiavitù ».

Thucydides History of the Peloponnesian War 5.86

Adolf Wahrmund (Translator)

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