Aristotle Poetics 25.12

Thomas Twining (Translator)

Table of Contents

Search the Perseus Catalog for:

View: By Part
← Previous Next →
But if the Poet has represented things in neither of these ways, he may answer, that he has represented them as they are said and believed to be. Of this kind are the poetical descriptions of the Gods.

Poetics. Aristotle. Thomas Twining (Translator). London, UK. 1789.

Sponsored by Perseus Project, Tufts University.

Current edition Experimental

Poetics (Thomas Twining, 1789) (OCR draft) (English) (Thomas Twining's English translation of Aristotle's Poetics, published in 1789 and aligned to the Kassel reference passage sequence.)

Provisional text from uncorrected OCR; expect errors.

Editions (4)
Περὶ ποιητικῆς (OCR draft) (Aristotle, Poetics. Immanuel Bekker, editor, Aristotelis Opera, volume 2. Oxford: Oxford University Press, 1837.) — 25 focus
Περὶ ποιητικῆς (OCR draft) Perseus (Aristotle, De arte poetica liber. Rudolf Kassel, editor. Oxford: Clarendon Press, 1965. Reference edition for passage alignment.) — 25 focus
Poetics, Greek text (Ingram Bywater, 1909) (OCR draft) Experimental (Ingram Bywater's Greek text of Aristotle's Poetics, published in 1909.) — 25 focus
Poetics, Greek text (Franz Ritter, 1839) (OCR draft) Experimental (Franz Ritter's 1839 Greek edition, corrected against OCR of the represented copy and aligned to the conventional Perseus chapter-and-subchapter sequence.) — 25 focus
Translations (13)
Poetics (W. H. Fyfe) (OCR draft) Perseus (William Hamilton Fyfe's English translation of Aristotle's Poetics, Loeb Classical Library, 1939 printing.) — 25 focus
Arabic Poetics (Badawī edition, 1953) (OCR draft) (The ancient Arabic translation of Aristotle's Poetics in ʿAbd al-Raḥmān Badawī's 1953 edition.) — 25 focus
Poetics (S. H. Butcher, 1911) (OCR draft) Experimental (S. H. Butcher's English translation from Aristotle's Theory of Poetry and Fine Art, fourth edition, 1911.) — 25 focus
Aristotle on the Art of Poetry (Ingram Bywater, 1909) (OCR draft) Experimental (Ingram Bywater's English translation of Aristotle's Poetics, published in 1909.) — 25 focus
The Poetic of Aristotle (Henry James Pye, revised 1792) (OCR draft) Experimental (Henry James Pye's revised 1792 English translation, corrected against the 1788 first edition, aligned to the Kassel reference edition, and supplied with a selective apparatus of substantive 1788 readings.) — 25.12 focus
Or as [1] ' Orion, sole of all the starry train, • Ne'er bathes his blazing forehead in the main:' IL. XVIIL. where Orion is called the SOLE by a metaphor, because he is the most known and conspicuous.
The Poetic of Aristotle (Theodore Alois Buckley) (OCR draft) Experimental (Theodore Alois Buckley's English translation, first published in 1850 and represented from the Henry G. Bohn 1857 printing; corrected against a second OCR and aligned to the Kassel reference passage sequence.) — 25.12 focus
as Xenophanes observes, “At any rate they tell us such things6." Perhaps, however, it may be said, that it is not better, indeed, thus to speak, but that the thing was so; as in the passage concerning the arms [of the sleeping soldiers of Diomed]: 1 2
ἔγχεα δέ σφιν ὄρθ' ἐπὶ σαυρωτῆρος,
fixed upright in the earth
Their spears stood by
 For such was the custom at that time, as it is now 3 with the Illyrians. With respect, however, to the inquiry whether a thing is said or done by any one well or ill, we must not only regard the thing itself which is done or said, whether it is good or bad, but we must also [consider] the person by whom it is done or said, viz. concerning whom, or when, or to whom, or on what account, he speaks or acts; as whether it is for the sake of bringing to pass a greater good, or in order to avoid a greater evil. 4 But it is requisite to remove some objections by looking to the diction; as, for instance, to foreign words: On mules th' infection first began. For perhaps he does not use ούρῆας to signify mules, but guards8.
Poetica Latine conversa (Franciscus Ritter, 1839) (OCR draft) Experimental (Franz Ritter's Latin translation, corrected against OCR of the represented copy and aligned to the conventional Perseus chapter-and-subchapter sequence.) — 25 focus
La poëtique d'Aristote (André Dacier, 1692) (OCR draft) Experimental (André Dacier's French translation of Aristotle's Poetics, published in 1692.) — 25.12 focus
Que ſi on ne peut ſe ſervir d'aucune de ces deux maniéres pour les réfuter, il faut avoir recours à la renommée, & faire voir qu'on l'a dit ainſi. C'eſt par-là qu'on ſauve ce qu'Homere a dit des Dieux;
Poetica d'Aristotile (Bernardo Segni, 1549) (OCR draft) Experimental (Bernardo Segni's 1549 Florentine Italian translation, aligned to the Kassel reference passage sequence.) — 25 focus
De poetica (Antonio Riccobono, 1587) (OCR draft) Experimental (Antonio Riccobono's Latin translation, first published in 1587; text represented from Immanuel Bekker's 1831 edition.) — 25 focus
De arte poetica liber (William of Moerbeke, ca. 1277) (OCR draft) Experimental (William of Moerbeke's medieval Latin translation, represented by the 1953 Aristoteles Latinus edition.) — 25 focus
Arabic Poetics (Abū Bishr Mattā; Tkatsch edition) (OCR draft) Experimental (The Arabic translation attributed to Abū Bishr Mattā, edited by Jaroslaus Tkatsch in 1928 and aligned to the Kassel reference passage sequence.) — 25 focus
Arabic Poetics (Abū Bishr Mattā; Tkatsch edition, unaligned) (OCR draft) Experimental (Tkatsch's edition of the medieval Arabic translation in its original, unaligned segmentation.) — 25 focus

Commentary

Commentary on the Poetics (Ingram Bywater, 1909) (OCR draft) (Ingram Bywater's English commentary on Aristotle's Poetics.) focus

12. mvp-aristotle-comment-994

ὅτι οὕτω φασίν = λυτέον ὅτι οὕτω φασὶν εἶναι. The construction λύειν ὅτι ('to refute by saying that') is found in Soph. el. 24, 179b 34
ἁμαρτάνουσι καὶ οἱ λύοντες ὅτι ἅpas ἀριθμὸς ὀλίγος.
- Rhet. 2. 25, 1402 a 34
οὔκουν ἱκανὸν ἂν λύσῃ ὅτι οὐκ ἀναγκαῖον, ἀλλὰ δεῖ λύειν ὅτι οὐκ εἰκός.
- Fr. 166 (Teubn.)
ἔστι δὲ λύειν ὅτι τοιαῦτα ἦν.
 ... τὰ περὶ θεῶν: i, e. the poetic statements about Gods, though neither true nor better than the truth, may perhaps be said to be sanctioned by opinion, and to be what people are in the habit of repeating of the Gods.
1461a1

Remarques sur la poëtique d'Aristote (André Dacier, 1692) (OCR draft) (André Dacier's French commentary on Aristotle's Poetics.) focus

18. mvp-aristotle-comment-613

25.12 18. Que si on ne peut se fervir d'aucune de ces deux manieres pour les réfuter, il faut avoir recours à la Renommée, & faire voir qu'on l'a dit ainſi.] 1

19. mvp-aristotle-comment-614

25.12 19. C'eſt par là qu'on ſauve ce qu' Homere a dit des Dieux, car il peut bien être, que ce qu'il en dit, n'est ny vray, ny meilleur de cette manière ; mais il a ſuivi ce qu'on en a publié.] 2

Commentary on the Poetics (Henry James Pye, 1792) (OCR draft) (Henry James Pye's 1792 English commentary, aligned to the Kassel reference edition.) focus

25.8. mvp-aristotle-comment-116 25.12

SOMETIMES THE OBJECTION MAY BE ANSWERED BY ATTENDING TO THE ACCENT.

THE sense of a word is seldom materially changed by the accent in English [s]. Substantives and verbs are sometimes so diftinguished, as ' cónverse,' and ' to converse;' ' convert,' and ' to convért.' Yet some words are entirely changed in fignification by the accent, as 'gállant, and 'gallant;'' piquet,' the game, and the ' píquet,' of an encamped battalion. [s] Ariftotle, in his Treatise De Sophisticis Elenchis, L. 1. Chap. Iv. where he treats of this effect of accent as to creating doubts, and illustrates it by the fame examples, makes this very curious remark. Παρὰ δὲ τὴν προσωδίαν ἐν μὲν τοις ἄνευ γραφῆς διαλεκλικοις ἐ ῥάδιον ποῖησαι λέγον· ἐν δὲ τοῖς γεγραμμέναις κὶ ποιήμασι μάλλον. • It is not easy to make a • fallacy by the accent in arguments not written, but rather in written language and poetry." From this it is obvious, that in the time of Ariftotle Greek was spoken by accent, and that the accents were not marked in writing, nor apparent in the recitation of verse; that is, I imagine, in the recitation of Greek verse, accent was lost in the superior momentum given to quantity, as in Latin verse, and even in Greek verse as we now read it, quantity is lost
in the superior momentum we give to Latin accentuation. NOTE

Commentarius in Aristotelis Poeticam (Franciscus Ritter, 1839) (OCR draft) (Ritter's Latin commentary, extracted from the 1839 volume, divided by Ritter's chapters and sections, and linked to the corresponding Perseus reference subsections.) focus

7. mvp-aristotle-comment-190

Ritter, cap. 25 § 7

εἰ δὲ μηδετέρως, ὅτι οὕτω φασίν : si neque ea excusatio fieri potest, contra accidens peccatum esse, neque altera, id quod oporteat poetam fingere, dicatur sic ferri hominum fama. inepta excusatio, quae quid valeat perbene intellexit verus Aristoteles c. 24, 10. ὥστε τὸ λέ γειν ὅτι ἀνήρητο ἂν ὁ μῦθος γελοῖον, cet. cf, c. 14, 5. 15,8. 17,3. ἀλλ᾽ ἔτυχεν ὡς παρά Ξενοφάνει: sed acciderunt ut est apud Xenophanem. haec pertinent ad Xenophanis de dis deorumque natura iudicium, quod multum distabat a ceteris poetis vulgarem opinionem et fabulas popularium sectantibus, partim in opere περὶ Φύσεως partim in Sillis sive Iambis pronuntiatum. vid. Sext. Empiricus adv. Mathem. VII, 49 et IX, 193. sententia igitur haec est: fortasse mala sunt et falsa quae de dis feruntur, et potius sic se habuere 6) Fortasse hoc ipsum ex Aristophanis fabula quadam, v. c. ex Gerytade vel alia, profectum est. quae in Ranis Aeschylus de sua poesi et Euripides de sua gloriatur v. 907 - 1073., alter alterum irridens, haec eo recurrunt ut Aeschylus dicat se ostendisse homines quales esse oporteat, Euripides contra dicat se fecisse quales sint.ut est apud Xenophanem, sed haec non dicunt. relicuum est ut de loci scriptura dispiciamus. codices fere (cf. not. crit.) praebent Ξενοφάνει vel Ξενοφάνη vel Ξενοφάνῃ, quarum formarum altera et tertia leviter a prima aberrant. hanc igitur ex pluribus et fidelioribus codicibus sumptam recipio, et leve ac vulgare vitium ὥσπερ in ὡς παρὰ corrigendum existimo. hoc ipsum vitium quartam illius nominis formam Ξενοφάνης videtur procreasse, quae apud Aldum et in libro Bc (si fides est silentio) reperitur: sed ἔτυχεν ὥσπερ Ξενοφάνης quid sit nemo explicare poterit. Victorius in sequentibus ἀλλ' οὐ φασι τάδε vitium latere suspicatus scribendum coniecit ἀλλ' οὐ σαφῆ τάδε, quo recepto nonnulli legunt ἀλλ' ἔτυχεν ὥσπερ Ξενοφάνει οὐ σαφῆ τάδε : sed haec quo pertineant neque satis liquet et illa ἀλλ' οὐ φασι τάδε certe ab omni dubitatione tuta sunt. ἴσως οὐ βέλτιον μέν: δὲ ab Aldo post ἴσως additum conducere videatur ad iuvandam iustam orationis iuncturam, sed ea ipsa apud hunc hominem saepius desideratur. οἷον τὰ περὶ τῶν ὅπλων κτλ. intelligit verba Homeri Il. K. 152. ἔγχεα δέ σφιν ὄρθ᾽ ἐπὶ σαυρωτῆρος ἐνήλατο. quid vitii in his invenerint critici illi ad controversias nimium proclives ex Porphyrii ad versum illum adnotatione (vid. Schol. in Homeri Il. ed. Bekker. pag. 279 b 42) discimus: φαύλη δοκεῖ ἡ τῶν δοράτων ἐπὶ σαυρωτῆρας στάσις· καὶ δὴ πολλαχοῦ θόρυβον ἤδη πεποίηκε νύκτωρ ἓν μόνον πεσόν. λύει δ' ᾿Αριστοτέλης (respicit Problemata Homerica, non hunc Poeticae locum) λέγων ὅτι τοιαῦ τα ἀεὶ ποιεῖ Ὅμηρος οἷα ἦν τότε. quid sit σαυρωτήρ explicat scholiasta anonymus in eadem illa farragine 1. c. in hunc modum : σαυρωτήρ δέ ἐστι τὸ ἀπολῆγον μέρος τοῦ δόρατος, ὅπερ ἀντίκειται τῇ αἰχμῇ, ὃν καὶ οὐρίαχον καλοῦσιν. οὕτω γὰρ τότ᾽ ἐνόμιζον, ὥσπερ καὶ νῦν Ἰλλυριοί: similia his Porphyrius 1. c. ἦν δὲ τοιαῦτα τὰ· παλαιὰ οἷάπερ καὶ νῦν ἐν τοῖς βαρβάροις· πολλοὶ δὲ οὕτω χρῶνται τῶν βαρβάρων.