Lucian of Samosata, Hermotimus, ed. Kenneth Kilburn, 35

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ΕΡΜΟΤΙΜΟΣ

Ὦ Λυκῖνε, πρὸς τῆς Ἑστίας, Πλάτωνα μὲν καὶ Ἀριστοτέλην καὶ Ἐπίκουρον καὶ τοὺς ἄλλους ἀτρεμεῖν ἐάσωμεν· οὐ γὰρ κατ' ἐμὲ ἀνταγωνίζεσθαι αὐτοῖς. νὼ δέ, ἐγώ τε καὶ σύ, ἐφ' ἡμῶν αὐτῶν ἐξετάσωμεν, εἰ τοιοῦτόν ἐστι τὸ φιλοσοφίας πρᾶγμα οἷον ἐγώ φημι αὐτὸ εἶναι. Αἰθίοπας δέ γε ἢ τὴν Γέλωνος γυναῖκα τί ἔδει καλεῖν ἐκ Συρακουσῶν ἐπὶ τὸν λόγον;

ΛΥΚΙΝΟΣ

Ἀλλ' ἐκεῖνοι μὲν ἀπίτωσαν ἐκποδών, εἴ σοι δοκοῦσι περιττοὶ εἶναι πρὸς τὸν λόγον. σὺ δὲ λέγε ἤδη. θαυμαστὸν γάρ τι ἐρεῖν ἔοικας.

ΕΡΜΟΤΙΜΟΣ

Δοκεῖ μοι, ὦ Λυκῖνε, καὶ πάνυ δυνατὸν εἶναι μόνα τὰ τῶν Στωϊκῶν ἐκμαθόντα εἰδέναι τἀληθὲς ἀπὸ τούτων, κἂν μὴ τὰ τῶν ἄλλων ἐπεξέλθῃ τις ἐκμανθάνων ἕκαστα. οὑτωσὶ δὲ σκόπει· ἤν τις λέγῃ πρός σέ μόνον τοῦτο ὡς αἱ δύο δυάδες τὸν τέτταρα ἀριθμὸν ἀποτελοῦσιν, ἆρα δεήσει περιιόντα σε πυνθάνεσθαι τῶν ἄλλων ὅσοι ἀριθμητικοὶ μή τις ἄρα εἴη πέντε ἢ ἑπτὰ λέγων αὐτὰς εἶναι; ἢ αὐτίκα εἰδείης ἂν ὅτι ὁ ἀνὴρ ἀληθῆ λέγει;

ΛΥΚΙΝΟΣ

Αὐτίκα, ὦ Ἑρμότιμε.

ΕΡΜΟΤΙΜΟΣ

Τί ποτ' οὖν ἀδύνατον εἶναί σοι δοκεῖ, ἐντυγχάνοντά τινα μόνοις τοῖς Στωϊκοῖς λέγουσι τἀληθῆ πείθεσθαί τε αὐτοῖς καὶ μηκέτι δεῖσθαι τῶν ἄλλων εἰδότα ὡς οὐκ ἄν ποτε τὰ τέτταρα πέντε γένοιτο, οὐδ’ ἂν μυρίοι Πλάτωνες ἢ Πυθαγόραι λέγωσιν;

Hermotimus. Lucian of Samosata. ed. Kenneth Kilburn. Medford, MA. Perseus 5.0.

Sponsored by Perseus Project, Tufts University.

Funding provided by The National Endowment for the Humanities.

Current edition Perseus

Σκύθης ἢ πρόξενος (Greek) (Lucian, Vol. 6. Kilburn, Kenneth, editor. London: William Heinemann, Ltd.; Cambridge, MA: Harvard University Press, 1959 (unrenewed copyright).)

Editions (1)

Ἑρμότιμος ἢ Περὶ Αἱρέσεων Perseus (Lucian. Luciani Samosatensis Opera, Vol. 1. Jacobitz, Karl, editor. Leipzig: Teubner, 1909.) — 35 focus

Ἑρμότιμος

ὦ Λυκῖνε, πρὸς τῆς Ἑστίας, Πλάτωνα μὲν καὶ Ἀριστοτέλην καὶ Ἐπίκουρον καὶ τοὺς ἄλλους ἀτρεμεῖν ἐάσωμεν· οὐ γὰρ κατʼ ἐμὲ ἀνταγωνίζεσθαι αὐτοῖς· νὼ δέ, ἐγώ τε καὶ σύ, ἐφʼ ἡμῶν αὐτῶν ἐξετάσωμεν, εἰ τοιοῦτόν ἐστι τὸ φιλοσοφίας πρᾶγμα, οἷον ἐγώ φημι αὐτὸ εἶναι. Αἰθίοπας δέ γε ἢ τὴν Γέλωνος γυναῖκα 777 τί ἔδει καλεῖν ἐκ Συρακουσῶν ἐπὶ τὸν λόγον;

Λυκῖνος

ἀλλʼ ἐκεῖνοι μὲν ἀπίτωσαν ἐκποδών, εἴ σοι δοκοῦσι περιττοὶ εἶναι πρὸς τὸν λόγον· σὺ δὲ λέγε ἤδη· θαυμαστὸν γάρ τι ἐρεῖν ἔοικας.

Ἑρμότιμος

δοκεῖ μοι, ὦ Λυκῖνε, καὶ πάνυ δυνατὸν εἶναι μόνα τὰ τῶν Στωϊκῶν ἐκμαθόντα εἰδέναι τἀληθὲς ἀπὸ τούτων, κἂν μὴ τὰ τῶν ἄλλων ἐπεξέλθῃ τις ἐκμανθάνων ἕκαστα. οὑτωσὶ δὲ σκόπει· ἤν τις λέγῃ πρὸς σὲ μόνον τοῦτο, ὡς αἱ δύο δυάδες τὸν τέτταρα ἀριθμὸν ἀποτελοῦσιν, ἆρα δεήσει περιιόντα σε πυνθάνεσθαι τῶν ἄλλων, ὅσοι ἀριθμητικοί, μή τις ἄρα εἴη πέντε ἢ ἑπτα λέγων αὐτὰς εἶναι; ἢ αὐτίκα εἰδείης ἂν ὅτι ὁ ἀνὴρ ἀληθῆ λέγει;

Λυκῖνος

αὐτίκα, ὦ Ἑρμότιμε.

Ἑρμότιμος

τί ποτʼ οὖν ἀδύνατον εἶναί σοι δοκεῖ, ἐντυγχάνοντά τινα μόνοις τοῖς Στωϊκοῖς λέγουσι τἀληθῆ πείθεσθαί τε αὐτοῖς καὶ μηκέτι δεῖσθαι τῶν ἄλλων εἰδότα ὡς οὐκ ἄν ποτε τὰ τέτταρα πέντε γένοιτο, οὐδʼ ἂν μυρίοι Πλάτωνες ἢ Πυθαγόραι λέγωσιν;

Translations (2)

The Scythian or Consul Perseus (Lucian, Vol. 6. Kilburn, Kenneth, translator. London: William Heinemann, Ltd.; Cambridge, MA: Harvard University Press, 1959 (unrenewed copyright).) — 35 focus

HERMOTIMUS

In Hestia’s name, Lycinus, let us leave Plato and Aristotle and Epicurus and the others undisturbed, for I am no match for them. Let us, you and me, enquire into it by ourselves, whether the pursuit of philosophy is as I say it is. As for Ethiopians and Gelo’s wife, why did you have to call her from Syracuse into the discussion?

LYCINUS

Why, let them take themselves off, if they seem to you to be superfluous to the discussion. You do the talking now. You look as though you are going to say something wonderful.

HERMOTIMUS

It seems to me quite possible, Lycinus, by thorough study of the Stoic doctrines alone, to know the truth from them, even if one does not pursue those of the others and make a thorough study of them in detail. Look at it this way: if someone tells you merely that two twos make the number four, will you have to go about questioning all the other mathematicians to see if there may not perhaps be one of them who makes it five or seven? Or would you know at once that this man is speaking the truth?

LYCINUS

At once, Hermotimus.

HERMOTIMUS

Why then does it seem to you to be impossible for a man when he meets only Stoics who speak the truth to believe them and have no further need of the others in his knowledge that four could never be five, even if thousands of Platos and Pythagorases say so?

Hermotimus, or the Rival Philosophies Perseus (The Works of Lucian of Samosata, Vol. 2. Fowler, Henry Watson and Fowler, Francis George, translators. Oxford: Clarendon Press, 1905.) — 35 focus

[35]

Hermotimus

For Heaven’s sake, Lycinus, let us leave Plato, Aristotle, Epicurus, and the rest of them alone; to argue with them is not for me. Why not just hold a private inquiry, you and I, whether philosophy is what I say it is? As for the Ethiopians and Gelo’s wife, what a long way you have brought them on none of their business!

Lycinus

Away with them, then, if you find their company superfluous. And now do you proceed; my expectations are high.

Hermotimus

Well, it seems to me perfectly possible, Lycinus, after studying the Stoic doctrines alone, to get at the truth from them, without going through a course of all the others too. Look at it this way: if any one tells you simply, Twice two is four, need you go round all the mathematicians to find out whether there is one who makes it five, or seven;_ or would you know at once that the man was right?

Lycinus

Certainly I should.

Hermotimus

Then why should you think it impossible for a man who finds, without going further, that the Stoics make true statements, to believe them and dispense with further witness? He knows that four can never be five, though ten: thousand Platos or Pythagorases said it was.

Lucian of Samosata Hermotimus 35

ed. Kenneth Kilburn

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ΛΥΚΙΝΟΣ

Ἀλλ' ἐκεῖνοι μὲν ἀπίτωσαν ἐκποδών, εἴ σοι δοκοῦσι περιττοὶ εἶναι πρὸς τὸν λόγον. σὺ δὲ λέγε ἤδη. θαυμαστὸν γάρ τι ἐρεῖν ἔοικας.

ΛΥΚΙΝΟΣ

Αὐτίκα, ὦ Ἑρμότιμε.

Current edition Perseus

Λυκῖνος

ἀλλʼ ἐκεῖνοι μὲν ἀπίτωσαν ἐκποδών, εἴ σοι δοκοῦσι περιττοὶ εἶναι πρὸς τὸν λόγον· σὺ δὲ λέγε ἤδη· θαυμαστὸν γάρ τι ἐρεῖν ἔοικας.

Λυκῖνος

αὐτίκα, ὦ Ἑρμότιμε.

LYCINUS

Why, let them take themselves off, if they seem to you to be superfluous to the discussion. You do the talking now. You look as though you are going to say something wonderful.

LYCINUS

At once, Hermotimus.

HERMOTIMUS

Why then does it seem to you to be impossible for a man when he meets only Stoics who speak the truth to believe them and have no further need of the others in his knowledge that four could never be five, even if thousands of Platos and Pythagorases say so?

Hermotimus

Lycinus

Hermotimus

Lycinus

Hermotimus

Stable identifiers

Search the Perseus Catalog for:

Search the Perseus Catalog for:

ΛΥΚΙΝΟΣ Ἀλλ' ἐκεῖνοι μὲν ἀπίτωσαν ἐκποδών, εἴ σοι δοκοῦσι περιττοὶ εἶναι πρὸς τὸν λόγον. σὺ δὲ λέγε ἤδη. θαυμαστὸν γάρ τι ἐρεῖν ἔοικας.

ΛΥΚΙΝΟΣ Αὐτίκα, ὦ Ἑρμότιμε.

Current edition Perseus

Λυκῖνος ἀλλʼ ἐκεῖνοι μὲν ἀπίτωσαν ἐκποδών, εἴ σοι δοκοῦσι περιττοὶ εἶναι πρὸς τὸν λόγον· σὺ δὲ λέγε ἤδη· θαυμαστὸν γάρ τι ἐρεῖν ἔοικας.

Λυκῖνος αὐτίκα, ὦ Ἑρμότιμε.

LYCINUS Why, let them take themselves off, if they seem to you to be superfluous to the discussion. You do the talking now. You look as though you are going to say something wonderful.

LYCINUS At once, Hermotimus.

HERMOTIMUS Why then does it seem to you to be impossible for a man when he meets only Stoics who speak the truth to believe them and have no further need of the others in his knowledge that four could never be five, even if thousands of Platos and Pythagorases say so?

Hermotimus

Lycinus

Hermotimus

Lycinus

Hermotimus

Stable identifiers

ΛΥΚΙΝΟΣ

Ἀλλ' ἐκεῖνοι μὲν ἀπίτωσαν ἐκποδών, εἴ σοι δοκοῦσι περιττοὶ εἶναι πρὸς τὸν λόγον. σὺ δὲ λέγε ἤδη. θαυμαστὸν γάρ τι ἐρεῖν ἔοικας.

ΛΥΚΙΝΟΣ

Αὐτίκα, ὦ Ἑρμότιμε.

Λυκῖνος

ἀλλʼ ἐκεῖνοι μὲν ἀπίτωσαν ἐκποδών, εἴ σοι δοκοῦσι περιττοὶ εἶναι πρὸς τὸν λόγον· σὺ δὲ λέγε ἤδη· θαυμαστὸν γάρ τι ἐρεῖν ἔοικας.

Λυκῖνος

αὐτίκα, ὦ Ἑρμότιμε.

LYCINUS

Why, let them take themselves off, if they seem to you to be superfluous to the discussion. You do the talking now. You look as though you are going to say something wonderful.

LYCINUS

At once, Hermotimus.

HERMOTIMUS

Why then does it seem to you to be impossible for a man when he meets only Stoics who speak the truth to believe them and have no further need of the others in his knowledge that four could never be five, even if thousands of Platos and Pythagorases say so?