Lucian, Juppiter Confutatus, Henry Watson Fowler (Translator), Francis George Fowler (Translator), 18

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Zeus

What! you doubt that there are punishments and rewards to come? You doubt of that judgement-seat before which every soul is arraigned?

Cyniscus

I have heard mention of a judge in that connexion; one Minos, a Cretan. Ah, yes, tell me about him: they say he is your son?

Zeus

And what of him?

Cyniscus

Whom does he punish in particular?

Zeus

Whom but the wicked?, Murderers, for instance, and temple-robbers.

Cyniscus

And whom does he send to dwell with the heroes?

Zeus

Good men and God-fearing, who have led virtuous lives.

Cyniscus

Why?

Zeus

Because they deserve punishment and reward respectively.

Cyniscus

Suppose a man commits a crime accidentally; does he punish him just the same?

Zeus

Certainly not.

Cyniscus

Similarly, if a man involuntarily performed a good action, he would not reward him?

Zeus

No.

Cyniscus

Then there is no one for him to reward or punish.

Zeus

How so?

Cyniscus

Why, we men do nothing of our own free will: we are obeying an irresistible impulse,—that is, if there is any truth in what we settled just now, about Fate’s being the cause of everything. Does aman commit a murder? Fate is the murderess. Does he rob a temple? He has her instructions for it. So if there is going to be any justice in Minos’s sentences, he will punish Destiny, not Sisyphus; Fate, not Tantalus. What harm did these men do? They only obeyed orders.

Juppiter Confutatus. Lucian. Henry Watson Fowler (Translator), Francis George Fowler (Translator). Medford, MA, USA. 2023-08-01.

Current edition Perseus

Zeus Cross-examined (English) (The Works of Lucian of Samosata, Vol. 3. Fowler, Henry Watson and Fowler, Francis George, translators. Oxford: Clarendon Press, 1905.)

Editions (1)

Ζεὺς ἐλεγχόμενος Perseus (Lucian, Vol. 2. Harmon, Austin Morris, editor. London: William Heinemann, Ltd.; Cambridge, MA: Harvard University Press, 1915.) — 18 focus

Ζεύς

τί φής; ἀπιστεῖς εἶναί τινας κολάσεις καὶ τιμάς, καὶ δικαστήριον ἔνθα δὴ ἐξετάζεται ὁ ἑκάστου βίος;

Κυνίσκος

ἀκούω τινὰ Μίνω Κρῆτα δικάζειν κάτω τὰ τοιαῦτα· καί μοι ἀπόκριναί τι καὶ ὑπὲρ ἐκείνου· σὸς γὰρ υἱὸς εἶναι λέγεται.

Ζεύς

τί δὲ κἀκεῖνον ἐρωτᾷς, ὦ Κυνίσκε;

Κυνίσκος

τίνας κολάζει μάλιστα;

Ζεύς

τοὺς πονηροὺς δηλαδή, οἷον ἀνδροφόνους καὶ ἱεροσύλους.

Κυνίσκος

τίνας δὲ παρὰ τοὺς ἥρωας ἀποπέμπει;

Ζεύς

τοὺς ἀγαθούς τε καὶ ὁσίους καὶ κατʼ ἀρετὴν βεβιωκότας.

Κυνίσκος

τίνος ἕνεκα, ὦ Ζεῦ;

Ζεύς

διότι οἱ μὲν τιμῆς, οἱ δὲ κολάσεως ἄξιοι.

Κυνίσκος

εἰ δέ τις ἀκούσιόν τι δεινὸν ἐργάσαιτο, κολάζεσθαι καὶ τοῦτον δικαιοῖ;

Ζεύς

οὐδαμῶς.

Κυνίσκος

οὐδʼ ἄρα εἴ τις ἄκων τι ἀγαθὸν ἔδρασεν, οὐδὲ τοῦτον τιμᾶν ἀξιώσειεν ἄν;

Ζεύς

οὐ γὰρ οὖν.

Κυνίσκος

οὐδένα τοίνυν, ὦ Ζεῦ, οὔτε τιμᾶν οὔτε κολάζειν αὐτῷ προσήκει.

Ζεύς

πῶς οὐδένα;

Κυνίσκος

ὅτι οὐδὲν ἑκόντες οἱ ἄνθρωποι ποιοῦμεν, ἀλλά τινι ἀνάγκῃ ἀφύκτῳ κεκελευσμένοι, εἴ γε ἀληθῆ ἐκεῖνά ἐστι τὰ ἔμπροσθεν ὡμολογημένα, ὡς ἡ Μοῖρα πάντων αἰτία· καὶ ἢν φονεύσῃ¹ τις, ἐκείνη ἐστὶν ἡ φονεύσασα, καὶ ἢν ἱεροσυλῇ, προστεταγμένον αὐτὸ δρᾷ. ὥστε εἴ γε τὰ δίκαια ὁ Μίνως δικάζειν μέλλοι, τὴν Εἱμαρμένην ἀντὶ τοῦ Σισύφου κολάσεται καὶ τὴν Μοῖραν ἀντὶ τοῦ Ταντάλου. τί γὰρ ἐκεῖνοι ἠδίκησαν πεισθέντες τοῖς ἐπιτάγμασιν;

Translations (1)

Zeus Catechized Perseus (Lucian, Vol. 2. Harmon, Austin Morris, editor. London: William Heinemann, Ltd.; Cambridge, MA: Harvard University Press, 1915.) — 18 focus

ZEUS

What’s that you say? Don’t you believe that there are any punishments and rewards, and a court where each man’s life is scrutinized!

CYNISCUS

I hear that somebody named Minos, a Cretan, acts as judge in such matters down below. And please answer me a question on his behalf, for he is your son, they say.

ZEUS

What have you to ask him, Cyniscus?

CYNISCUS

Whom does he punish principally?

ZEUS

wicked, of course, such as murderers and temple-robbers.

CYNISCUS

And whom does he send to join the heroes?

ZEUS

Those who were good and pious and lived virtuously.

CYNISCUS

Why is that, Zeus?

ZEUS

Because the latter deserve reward and the former punishment.

CYNISCUS

But if a man should do a dreadful thing unintentionally, would he think it right to punish him like the others?

ZEUS

Not by any means.

CYNISCUS

I suppose, then, if a man did something good unintentionally, he would not think fit to reward him, either?

ZEUS

Certainly not!

CYNISCUS

Then, Zeus, he ought not to reward or punish anyone.

ZEUS

Why not?

CYNISCUS

Because we men do nothing of our own accord. but only at the behest of some inevitable necessity, if what you previously admitted is true, that Fate is the cause of everything If a man slay, it is she who slays, and if he rob temples, he only does it under orders. Therefore if Minos were to judge justly, he would punish Destiny instead of Sisyphus and Fate instead of Tantalus, for what wrong did they do in obeying orders?

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Zeus What! you doubt that there are punishments and rewards to come? You doubt of that judgement-seat before which every soul is arraigned?

Cyniscus I have heard mention of a judge in that connexion; one Minos, a Cretan. Ah, yes, tell me about him: they say he is your son?

Zeus And what of him?

Cyniscus Whom does he punish in particular?

Zeus Whom but the wicked?, Murderers, for instance, and temple-robbers.

Cyniscus And whom does he send to dwell with the heroes?

Zeus Good men and God-fearing, who have led virtuous lives.

Cyniscus Why?

Zeus Because they deserve punishment and reward respectively.

Cyniscus Suppose a man commits a crime accidentally; does he punish him just the same?

Zeus Certainly not.

Cyniscus Similarly, if a man involuntarily performed a good action, he would not reward him?

Zeus No.

Cyniscus Then there is no one for him to reward or punish.

Zeus How so?

Current edition Perseus

Ζεύς τί φής; ἀπιστεῖς εἶναί τινας κολάσεις καὶ τιμάς, καὶ δικαστήριον ἔνθα δὴ ἐξετάζεται ὁ ἑκάστου βίος;

Κυνίσκος ἀκούω τινὰ Μίνω Κρῆτα δικάζειν κάτω τὰ τοιαῦτα· καί μοι ἀπόκριναί τι καὶ ὑπὲρ ἐκείνου· σὸς γὰρ υἱὸς εἶναι λέγεται.

Ζεύς τί δὲ κἀκεῖνον ἐρωτᾷς, ὦ Κυνίσκε;

Κυνίσκος τίνας κολάζει μάλιστα;

Ζεύς τοὺς πονηροὺς δηλαδή, οἷον ἀνδροφόνους καὶ ἱεροσύλους.

Κυνίσκος τίνας δὲ παρὰ τοὺς ἥρωας ἀποπέμπει;

Ζεύς τοὺς ἀγαθούς τε καὶ ὁσίους καὶ κατʼ ἀρετὴν βεβιωκότας.

Κυνίσκος τίνος ἕνεκα, ὦ Ζεῦ;

Ζεύς διότι οἱ μὲν τιμῆς, οἱ δὲ κολάσεως ἄξιοι.

Κυνίσκος εἰ δέ τις ἀκούσιόν τι δεινὸν ἐργάσαιτο, κολάζεσθαι καὶ τοῦτον δικαιοῖ;

Ζεύς οὐδαμῶς.

Κυνίσκος οὐδʼ ἄρα εἴ τις ἄκων τι ἀγαθὸν ἔδρασεν, οὐδὲ τοῦτον τιμᾶν ἀξιώσειεν ἄν;

Ζεύς οὐ γὰρ οὖν.

Κυνίσκος οὐδένα τοίνυν, ὦ Ζεῦ, οὔτε τιμᾶν οὔτε κολάζειν αὐτῷ προσήκει.

Ζεύς πῶς οὐδένα;

ZEUS What’s that you say? Don’t you believe that there are any punishments and rewards, and a court where each man’s life is scrutinized!

CYNISCUS I hear that somebody named Minos, a Cretan, acts as judge in such matters down below. And please answer me a question on his behalf, for he is your son, they say.

ZEUS What have you to ask him, Cyniscus?

CYNISCUS Whom does he punish principally?

ZEUS wicked, of course, such as murderers and temple-robbers.

CYNISCUS And whom does he send to join the heroes?

ZEUS Those who were good and pious and lived virtuously.

CYNISCUS Why is that, Zeus?

ZEUS Because the latter deserve reward and the former punishment.

CYNISCUS But if a man should do a dreadful thing unintentionally, would he think it right to punish him like the others?

ZEUS Not by any means.

CYNISCUS I suppose, then, if a man did something good unintentionally, he would not think fit to reward him, either?

ZEUS Certainly not!

CYNISCUS Then, Zeus, he ought not to reward or punish anyone.

ZEUS Why not?

Stable identifiers

Zeus

What! you doubt that there are punishments and rewards to come? You doubt of that judgement-seat before which every soul is arraigned?

Cyniscus

I have heard mention of a judge in that connexion; one Minos, a Cretan. Ah, yes, tell me about him: they say he is your son?

Zeus

And what of him?

Cyniscus

Whom does he punish in particular?

Zeus

Whom but the wicked?, Murderers, for instance, and temple-robbers.

Cyniscus

And whom does he send to dwell with the heroes?

Zeus

Good men and God-fearing, who have led virtuous lives.

Cyniscus

Why?

Zeus

Because they deserve punishment and reward respectively.

Cyniscus

Suppose a man commits a crime accidentally; does he punish him just the same?

Zeus

Certainly not.

Cyniscus

Similarly, if a man involuntarily performed a good action, he would not reward him?

Zeus

No.

Cyniscus

Then there is no one for him to reward or punish.

Zeus

How so?

Ζεύς

τί φής; ἀπιστεῖς εἶναί τινας κολάσεις καὶ τιμάς, καὶ δικαστήριον ἔνθα δὴ ἐξετάζεται ὁ ἑκάστου βίος;

Κυνίσκος

ἀκούω τινὰ Μίνω Κρῆτα δικάζειν κάτω τὰ τοιαῦτα· καί μοι ἀπόκριναί τι καὶ ὑπὲρ ἐκείνου· σὸς γὰρ υἱὸς εἶναι λέγεται.

Ζεύς

τί δὲ κἀκεῖνον ἐρωτᾷς, ὦ Κυνίσκε;

Κυνίσκος

τίνας κολάζει μάλιστα;

Ζεύς

τοὺς πονηροὺς δηλαδή, οἷον ἀνδροφόνους καὶ ἱεροσύλους.

Κυνίσκος

τίνας δὲ παρὰ τοὺς ἥρωας ἀποπέμπει;

Ζεύς

τοὺς ἀγαθούς τε καὶ ὁσίους καὶ κατʼ ἀρετὴν βεβιωκότας.

Κυνίσκος

τίνος ἕνεκα, ὦ Ζεῦ;

Ζεύς

διότι οἱ μὲν τιμῆς, οἱ δὲ κολάσεως ἄξιοι.

Κυνίσκος

εἰ δέ τις ἀκούσιόν τι δεινὸν ἐργάσαιτο, κολάζεσθαι καὶ τοῦτον δικαιοῖ;

Ζεύς

οὐδαμῶς.

Κυνίσκος

οὐδʼ ἄρα εἴ τις ἄκων τι ἀγαθὸν ἔδρασεν, οὐδὲ τοῦτον τιμᾶν ἀξιώσειεν ἄν;

Ζεύς

οὐ γὰρ οὖν.

Κυνίσκος

οὐδένα τοίνυν, ὦ Ζεῦ, οὔτε τιμᾶν οὔτε κολάζειν αὐτῷ προσήκει.

Ζεύς

πῶς οὐδένα;

ZEUS

What’s that you say? Don’t you believe that there are any punishments and rewards, and a court where each man’s life is scrutinized!

CYNISCUS

I hear that somebody named Minos, a Cretan, acts as judge in such matters down below. And please answer me a question on his behalf, for he is your son, they say.

ZEUS

What have you to ask him, Cyniscus?

CYNISCUS

Whom does he punish principally?

ZEUS

wicked, of course, such as murderers and temple-robbers.

CYNISCUS

And whom does he send to join the heroes?

ZEUS

Those who were good and pious and lived virtuously.

CYNISCUS

Why is that, Zeus?

ZEUS

Because the latter deserve reward and the former punishment.

CYNISCUS

But if a man should do a dreadful thing unintentionally, would he think it right to punish him like the others?

ZEUS

Not by any means.

CYNISCUS

I suppose, then, if a man did something good unintentionally, he would not think fit to reward him, either?

ZEUS

Certainly not!

CYNISCUS

Then, Zeus, he ought not to reward or punish anyone.

ZEUS

Why not?