Plato Republic 10.614

Paul Shorey (Translator)

Republic. Plato. Paul Shorey (Translator). Cambridge, MA. 1935-37.

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Current edition Perseus

Republic (English) (Plato in Twelve Volumes, Vol. 5-6. Shorey, Paul, translator. Cambridge, MA, Harvard University Press; London, William Heinemann Ltd. 1935-37 (printing).)

Editions (1)
Πολιτεία Perseus (Platonis Opera Tomus IV: Tetralogia VIII. Burnet, John, editor. Oxford: Clarendon Press, 1905.) — 10.614 focus

Notes on the current edition

Republic

1. i.e. the just and unjust man.
2. τελέως: cf. 361 A.
3. See Proclus, In Remp.,Kroll ii. 96 ff., Macrob. in Somnium Scip. i. 2. The Epicurean Colotes highly disapproved of Plato’s method of putting his beliefs in this form. See Chassang, Histoire du roman, p. 15. See also Dieterich, Nekyia, pp. 114 ff., and Adam ad loc.
4. Odyssey ix.-xii. The term also became proverbial for a lengthy tale. See K. Tümpel, Ἀλκίνου ἀπόλογος, Philologus 52. 523 ff.
5. Plato puns on the name Alcinous. For other puns on proper names see on 580 B. See Arthur Platt, Plato’s Republic, 614 B, Class. Review, 1911, pp. 13-14. For the ἀλλὰ μέν without a corresponding δέ he compares Aristoph. Acharn. 428
οὐ Βελλεροφόντης· ἀλλὰ κἀκεῖνος μὲν ἦ χωλός . . .
(which Blaydes changed to ἀλλὰ μήν), Odyssey xv. 405 and Eryxias 308 B.
6. Perhaps we might say, of the tribe of Everyman. For the question of his identity see Platt, loc. cit.
7. Thomas Browne, Urn Burial, ch. iii.,
Plato’s historian of the other world lies twelve days incorrupted, while his soul was viewing the large stations of the dead,
See also Rohde, Psyche ii.6 pp. 92-93.
8. Stories of persons restored to life are fairly common in ancient literature. There are Eurydice and Alcestis in Greek mythology, in the Old Testament the son of the widow revived by Elijah (1 Kings xvii. 17 ff. Cf. 2 Kings iv. 34 ff. and xiii. 21), in the New Testament the daughter of Jairus ( Matt. ix. 23 f.), the son of the widow of Nain ( Luke vii. 11 ff.), and Lazarus( John xi.). but none of these recount their adventures. Cf. also Luke xvi. 31
If they hear not Moses and the prophets neither will they be persuaded through one rose from the dead.
But in that very parable Lazarus is shown in Abraham’s bosom and the rich man in torment. See further, Proclus, In Remp. ii. pp. 113-116, Rohde, Psyche ii.6 p. 191.
9. For the indirect reflexive cf. p. 507, note f, on 617 E.
10. For the description of the place of judgement cf. also Gorg. 524 A. Cf. Phaedo 107 D, 113 D, where there is no description but simply the statement that the souls are brought to a place and judged. On the topography of the myth in general cf. Bréhier, La Philos. de Plot. pp. 28-29:
Voyez, par exemple, la manière dont Numénius . . . interprète le mythe du Xe livre de Ia République, et comment il précise, avec Ia lourdeur d’un théologien, les traits que la poésie de Platon avait abandonnés à l’imagination du lecteur. Le lieu du jugement devient le centre du monde; le ciel platonicien devient Ia sphère des fixes; le lieu sonterrain où sont punies les âmes, ce sont les planètes; la bouche du ciel, par laquelle les âmes descendront à la naissance, est le tropique du Cancer; et c’est par le Capricorne qu’elles remontent.
11. Cf. Gorg. 523 E f., 524 E-525 B, 526 B-C.
12. Gorg. 526 B.
13. Cf. Gorg. 525 A-B, 526 B. For right and left cf. the story of the last judgement, Matt. xxv. 33-34 and 41.
14. Cf. the rich man’s request that a messenger be sent to his brethren, Luke xvi. 27-31.
15. ἐκεῖ: so in 330 D, 365 A, 498 C, Phaedo 61 E, 64 A, 67 B, 68 E, Apol. 40 E, 41 C, Crito 54 B, Symp. 192 E. In 500 D and Phaedr. 250 A it refers to the world of the ideas, in 516 C and 520 C to the world of the cave.
16. Cf. Gorg. 524 A.
17. Cf. 621 A, 610 E, and John i. 14
ἐσκήνωσεν
.
18. Cf. 421 B.

Commentary

Commentary on Plato, Republic (Plato. The Republic, Vol 1-2. Adam, James, editor. Cambridge: Cambridge University Press, 1902-1903.) focus

χρὴ δ’ αὐτὰ ἀκοῦσαι κτλ. The Νέκυια of the Republic is one of the earliest extant Apocalypses, and many of its features reappear in later apocalyptic literature, including that of the early Christian era. See James Apocrypha Anecdota in Robinson's Texts and Studies. A careful comparison of the myth in the Republic with those of the Phaedrus, Gorgias, and Phaedo shews that in spite of discrepancies in detail, the four dialogues conspire to produce what is on the whole a tolerably consistent picture of the destiny of the human soul—a kind of ancient ‘Divina Commedia,’ as Döring points out ( Archiv f. Gesch. d. Philos. VI pp. 475—490). The sources and affinities of Plato's eschatological myths have been much discussed. Besides the article by Döring on Die eschatologischen Mythen d. Plato ( Archiv l.c.) the student should consult Ettig Acheruntica ( Leipziger Stud. XIII 1891, pp. 251—402, especially 284 ff.), Norden Vergilstudien ( Hermes XXVIII 1893, pp. 360—406), and especially Dieterich Nekyia (Leipzig 1893), where the common features in ancient representations of the underworld are clearly exhibited. There are traces of Νέκυιαι before the time of Plato, and the investigations of Dieterich and others have made it clear that the materials of Plato's picture are derived in large measure from Orphic or Pythagorean traditions (Dieterich l.c. pp. 128 ff.: cf. also Norden l.c. p. 374, Rohde Psyche^{2} II pp. 91 ff., and Zeller^{5} I 1. p. 450. Dieterich may be wrong in some of his conjectures, as F. Weber tries to shew in his inaugural dissertation, Platonische Notizen über Orpheus München 1899 p. 20 note, but the broad outlines of his theory are in my opinion established beyond reasonable doubt). Evidence of Pythagorean and Orphic affinities will be cited in the notes. Cf. Proclus in remp. II p. 110 Kroll εἴτε δὲ ἔχει τὰ τῆς ἱστορίας οὕτως εἴτε καὶ μή, ζητεῖν ἄτοπον, τοῦ Πλάτωνος τὰ τοιαῦτα πλάττοντος μὲν οὐδαμῶς, κατὰ δὲ τὴν χρείαν τῶν προκειμένων ἀεὶ παραλαμβάνοντος καὶ χρωμένου πᾶσι μετὰ τῆς πρεπούσης περιβολῆς καὶ οἰκονομίας, ὡς καὶ τῇ Μαντινικῇ ξένῃ καὶ τῷ κατὰ τὸν Γύγου πρόγονον διηγήματι καὶ τῷ κατὰ τοὺς Ἀτλαντικοὺς λόγῳ καὶ πᾶσι τοῖς ὁμοίοις. We may well suppose, however, that the imagination of Plato dealt freely with his materials, and the myth of the Republic bears the unmistakeable impress of Plato's own genius in its artistic finish no less than in its religious and moral teaching.

ἑκάτερος . See cr. n. The accusative appears to be in all MSS except v K and Ξ^{2}.

ἀκοῦσαι is doubted by Stephanus, and bracketed by Ast, Stallbaum, and Baiter. There is nothing offensive in the repetition ἀκοῦσαι—ἀκοῦσαι (cf. VI 511 E note), and the second ἀκοῦσαι is welcome, if not necessary, as defining the exact nature of the debt (‘due to hear,’ i.e. ‘due to be heard,’ like καλὸς ἰδεῖν and the like). “The debt which has been incurred in words” ( ἃ ἐδανείσασθε ἐν τῷ λόγῳ 612 C) “has to be paid in words” (J. and C.). ὑπὸ depends on ὀφειλόμενα rather than on ἀκοῦσαι. J. and C. take ἀκοῦσαι as=‘to have related concerning them,’ comparing ἀκοῦσαι σοφίσματα VI 496 A and Lys. 207 A ; but it is more natural to give the word the same meaning as it bears just before.

Ἀλκίνου ‐‐ ἀπόλογον . Books IX—XII of the Odyssey were known as Ἀλκίνου ἀπόλογοι the ‘tales to Alcinous’: see Ael. Var. Hist. XIII 14 Ἀλκίνου ἀπολόγους [ καὶ] Κυκλώπειαν καὶ Νέκυιαν καὶ τὰ τῆς Κίρκης. Cf. Arist. Poet. 16. 1455^{a} 2 and Rhet. III 16. 1417^{a} 13, from which it appears that the whole four books were also called collectively ὁ Ἀλκίνου ἀπόλογος. There is doubtless an allusion, as the Oxford editors remark, to the νέκυια of Od. XI, which is itself one of the ‘tales to Alcinous’; but the expression has also a proverbial application, being used of a long and tedious story ( ἐπὶ τῶν φλυαρούντων καὶ μακρὸν ἀποτεινόντων λόγον Suidas s.v. Ἀπόλογος Ἀλκίνου. Other authorities will be found in Leutsch u. Schneidewin Paroem. Gr. I p. 210, II p. 13). For the paronomasia Ἀλκίνου — ἀλκίμου see Riddell Digest § 323.

Ἠρὸς τοῦ Ἀρμενίου κτλ. The names point to the East. Ἦρ ὄνομα κύριον Ἑβραικόν, says Suidas, and Er is one of the ancestors of Joseph, the husband of the Virgin Mary: see St Luke 3. 28. By some of the ancients, including Clement ( Strom. V 157 Migne), Er was identified with Zoroaster (Proclus l.c. p. 109). τοῦ Ἀρμενίου is of course ‘son of Armenius,’ not ‘the Armenian,’ as some ancient expositors imagined (see Proclus in remp. II p. 110). Plutarch Symp. IX 740 B appears to have read Ἁρμονίου, a reading which was known to Proclus (l.c.), and which commended itself also to the poet Gray: but Ἁρμονίου has no MS authority. Proclus himself adopts the same reading as that of our best MSS, and explains the passage quite correctly in p. 110. 19 ff.

δεκαταίων . The occurrence of the number 10 and its multiples is one of the Pythagorean elements of the story: cf. infra 615 A, B εἶναι δὲ τὴν πορείαν χιλιέτη (10^{3} years)— ὑπὲρ ἑκάστου δεκάκις—ὡς βίου ὄντος τοσούτου (10^{2} years) τοῦ ἀνθρωπίνου and εἰκοστήν in 620 B. See also on 614 C.

ἀναβιοὺς δὲ ‐‐ ἴδοι . Other miraculous stories about the dead or seemingdead returning to life again and describing what they have seen are given by Proclus l.c. pp. 113—116, 122. Cf. also Rohde Psyche^{2} II pp. 90—102.

ἀφικνεῖσθαι . In Phaed. 107 D and 113 D each soul is conducted by its δαίμων to the place of judgment.

τόπον τινὰ δαιμόνιον κτλ. The situation may be seen from the accompanying plan. AB is the τόπος δαιμόνιος or λειμών (614 E) in which the

χάσματα . Roeper ( de dual. usu Plat. p. 29) would read χάσματε (“id est, ut me monuit Usenerus, χάσματ’ ἐχομένω, a librario male suppletum”). The dual is also found in q and Flor. U; but there is hardly sufficient ground for deserting the best MSS: cf. III 395 A ἢ οὐ μιμήματα ἄρτι τούτω ἐκάλεις ; Lach. 187 A εἰ δ’ αὐτοὶ εὑρεταὶ γεγονότε (so B) τοῦ τοιούτου, and other passages in Roeper l.c. Proclus also has χάσματα ἐχομένω (l.c. p. 136. 17). With the two ways ( BC, AC') by which the souls depart after judgment cf. Gorg. 524 A ἐν τῇ τριόδῳ ἐξ ἧς φέρετον τὼ ὁδώ, ἡ μὲν ἐς μακάρων νήσους, ἡ δὲ εἰς τάρταρον: also Phaedr. 249 A . The ‘two ways’ were a familiar feature in Orphic-Pythagorean pictures of the other world: for illustrations see Dieterich l.c. pp. 191 ff. and Rohde Psyche^{2} II p. 220 note 4.

εἰς δεξιάν . The way to the abode of the blest was generally figured as εἰς δεξιάν: see Rohde l.c. and Dieterich l.c. p. 85 note 2, where Dieterich quotes from an Inscription found in a grave in the district of Thurii χαῖρε χαῖρε δεξιὰν ὁδοιπορῶν Αειμῶνάς τε ἱεροὺς κατά τ ἄλσεα Φερσεφονείας. The whole of this Inscription, according to Dieterich, be trays Orphic and Pythagorean influences. Cf. 617 C note The other features ( ἄνω, ἐν τῷ πρόσθεν, εἰς ἀριστεράν τε καὶ κάτω, ἐν τῷ ὄπισθεν) are also in keeping with Pythagorean notions: see Arist. Frag. 195 (1513^{a} 24 ff.) τὸ οὖν δεξιὸν καὶ ἄνω καὶ ἔμπροσθεν ἀγαθὸν ἐκάλουν, τὸ δὲ ἀριστερὸν καὶ κάτω καὶ ὄπισθεν κακὸν ἔλεγον, ὡς αὐτὸς Ἀριστοτέλης ἱστόρησεν ἐν τῇ τῶν Πυθαγορείοις ἀρεσκόντων συναγωγῇ.

διὰ τοῦ οὐρανοῦ . Presumably they passed up through the heavens to the outer surface of the heavenly sphere, as described in Phaedr. 247 B ff. Cf. also Proclus l.c. p. 160. 19 ff. πολλὰ δὲ ἐπορεύθησαν αἳ μὲν κατ’ οὐρανὸν συμπεριπολοῦσαι τοῖς οὐρανίοις θεοῖς κτλ.—clearly a reminiscence of Phaedr. 246 E ff.

σημεῖα κτλ. Cf. Gorg. 526 B . κάτω is fully explained in the myth of the Phaedo 111 C—114 C. Cf. infra 615 A.

πάντων ὧν ἔπραξαν from its correspondence with τῶν δεδικασμένων above suggests that our own actions are our doom.

καὶ διακελεύοιντο =‘and that they exhorted’ corresponds of course to καὶ διακελευόμεθα of the oratio recta. Stallbaum's explanation (“optativus ponitur loco accusativi cum infinitivo”) is untenable; nor is there any good reason for suspecting the text or writing διακελεύεσθαι with Eusebius ( Praep. Ev. XI 35. 5) and others. The optative is much more dramatic and realistic. Cf. VIII 569 A note

ταύτῃ μέν is explained by καθ’ ἑκάτερον—γῆς i.e. (see the figure on p. 435) BC and AC'. Cornarius conjectured καθ’ ἕτερον μὲν τὸ χάσμα, but ἑκάτερον is much more elegant, and forms a better balance with κατὰ δὲ τὼ ἑτέρω (viz. D'B and DA).

ἐκ τῆς γῆς is not of course ‘from earth’ (D. and V.), but ‘ out of the earth’ (‘aus der Erde’ Schneider). They have suffered punishment ἐν τῇ ὑπὸ γῆς πορείᾳ (615 A) ‘in their sojourn underground’ i.e. in the bowels of the Earth, as explained at length in Phaed. 113 E —114 B.

τὸν λειμῶνα . “Articulus locum quasi fama celebratum designat” Schneider. See on 614 C.