Titus Livius (Livy), Ab urbe condita, Benjamin Oliver Foster, Ph.D. (Editor), Frank Gardener Moore (Editor), Evan T. Sage, Ph.D. (Editor), Alfred C. Schlesinger, Ph.D. (Editor), 37.36

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[1] Since the ambassador realized that he could obtain no fairness in the council, he tried privately —for such were his orders —to win over Publius Scipio.

[2] First of all, he said that the king would restore to him his son without a ransom; then, ignorant of both the spirit of Scipio and the Roman tradition, he promised him a great sum of money and, with the single exception of the title of king, partnership in the entire kingdom if, through his aid, he succeeded in obtaining peace.

[3] To this Scipio replied:

That you do not know the Romans as a race, that you do not know me, to whom you¹ have been sent, I am less surprised to find since I see that you do not know the situation of the man from whom you come.

[4]

Lysimachia should have been held, to prevent our entering the Chersonesus, or resistance should have been offered at the Hellespont, to prevent our crossing into Asia, if you intended to ask peace from foes who were anxious about the outcome of the war;

[5]

but when we were given passage into Asia and when not only our reins but also our yoke was accepted, what debate is left on the basis of equity, when you are obliged to put up with our sovereignty?

[6]

Of the generous offers of the king, I accept the greatest, my son; as to the rest, I pray the gods that my estate will never need them; my soul, at any rate, will not need them.

[7]

In return for so great a gift to me, he will find me grateful to him if he desires private gratitude in return for a private kindness; in my public capacity I shall take nothing from him and give him nothing. What I can give him at this moment is my sincere advice.

[8]

Go, advise him in my words that he abandon the war and refuse no terms of peace.

[9] His words had no effect upon the king, who thought that the gamble of war would be a safe one, since even now terms were declared to him as if he already had been defeated. Mention of peace was forgotten for the moment, and all his energy was devoted to preparation for war.³

Ab urbe condita. Titus Livius (Livy). Benjamin Oliver Foster, Ph.D. (Editor), Frank Gardener Moore (Editor), Evan T. Sage, Ph.D. (Editor), Alfred C. Schlesinger, Ph.D. (Editor). Medford, MA. .

Sponsored by Perseus Project, Tufts University.

Funding provided by The National Endowment for the Humanities.

Current edition Perseus

History of Rome (English) (Foster, Benjamin Oliver; Moore, Frank Gardener; Sage, Evan T.; Schlesinger, Alfred C., translators. Cambridge, Mass.; London: Harvard University Press; William Heinemann, Ltd., 1919-1959. (Loeb Classical Library))

Editions (3)

Ab urbe condita Perseus (Pars I-IV, Libri I-XL. Editio Stereotypica. Weissenborn, Wilhelm; Mueller, Moritz, editors. Leipzig: Teubner, 1884-1911.) — 37.36 focus

[1] legatus postquam nihil aequi in consilio impetrare se censebat, privatim — sic enim imperatum erat — P. Scipionis temptare animum est conatus.

[2] omnium primum filium ei sine pretio redditurum regem dixit; deinde ignarus et animi Scipionis et moris Romani, auri pondus ingens est pollicitus, et nomine tantum regio excepto societatem omnis regni, si per eum pacem impetrasset.

[3] ad ea Scipio: “quod Romanos omnis, quod me, ad quem missus es, ignoras,

[4] minus miror, cum te fortunam eius, a quo venis, ignorare cernam. Lysimachia tenenda erat, ne Chersonesum intraremus, aut ad Hellespontum obsistendum,

[5] ne in Asiam traiceremus, si pacem tamquam ab sollicitis de belli eventu petituri eratis; concesso vero in Asiam transitu et non solum frenis, sed etiam iugo accepto quae disceptatio ex aequo, cum imperium patiendum sit, relicta est?

[6] ego ex munificentia regia maximum donum filium habebo; aliis, deos precor, ne umquam fortuna egeat mea; animus certe non egebit.

[7] pro tanto in me munere gratum me in se esse sentiet, si privatam gratiam pro privato beneficio desiderabit; publice nec habebo quicquam ab illo nec dabo.

[8] quod in praesentia dare possim, fidele consilium est. abi, nuntia meis verbis, bello absistat, pacis condicionem nullam recuset.”

[9] nihil ea moverunt regem, tutam fore belli aleam ratum, quando perinde ac victo iam sibi leges dicerentur. omissa igitur in praesentia mentione pacis totam curam in belli apparatum intendit.

Ab urbe condita Perseus (Livy in Fourteen Volumes. Foster, Benjamin Oliver; Moore, Frank Gardener; Schlesinger, Alfred C., editors. Cambridge, MA: Harvard University Press; London: William Heinemann, Ltd., 1919-1959 (printing).) — 43.23 focus

[1]

Rex cum non ¹ minore vexatione iumentorum hominumque quam venerat in Macedoniam rediit; Appium tamen ab obsidione Phanotes fama ducentis ad Stratum Persei summovit.

[2] Cleuas cum praesidio impigrorum iuvenum insecutus sub radicibus prope inviis montium ² ad mille hominum ex agmine impedito occidit, ad ducentos cepit.

[3] Appius superatis angustiis in campo quem Meleona vocant stativa dierum paucorum habuit. interim Cleuas assumpto Philostrato, qui quingentos ex ³ Epirotarum gente habebat, in agrum Antigonensem transcendit. ⁴ Macedones ad depopulationem profecti;

[4] Philostratus⁵ cum cohorte sua in insidiis loco ⁶ obscuro consedit. in palatos populatores cum erupissent ab Antigonea armati, ⁷ fugientes eos persequentes effusius in vallem insessam ab hostibus praecipitant.

[5] ibi ad mille ⁸ occisis, centum ferme captis, et ubique prospere gesta re prope stativa Appi castra movent, ne qua vis sociis suis ab Romano exercitu inferri possit.

[6] Appius nequiquam in his locis terens tempus, dimissis Chaonum Thesprotorumque ⁹ et si qui alii Epirotae erant praesidiis, cum Italicis militibus in Illyricum regressus, per Parthinorum ¹⁰ socias urbes in hiberna militibus divisis, ¹¹ ipse Romam sacrificii causa redit.

[7] Perseus ex Penestarum gente mille pedites, ducentos equites revocatos Cassandream, praesidio ut essent, misit.

[8] Ab Gentio eadem adferentes redierunt. nec deinde alios atque alios mittendo temptare eum destitit, cum appareret, quantum in eo praesidii esset, nec tamen impetrare ab animo posset, ut impensam in rem maximi ad omnia momenti faceret.

Ab urbe condita libri, erklärt von M. Weissenborn Perseus (Weissenborn, W.; Müller, H. J., editors. Berlin: Weidmannsche Buchhandlung, 1873-1883.) — 37.36 focus

[1]

legatus postquam nihil aequi in consilio impetrare se censebat, privatim — sic enim imperatum erat — P. Scipionis temptare animum est conatus.

[2] omnium primum filium ei sine pretio redditurum regem dixit; deinde ignarus et animi Scipionis et moris Romani, auri pondus ingens pollicitus est, et nomine tantum regio excepto societatem omnis regni, si per eum pacem impetrasset.

[3] ad ea Scipio: “quod Romanos omnis, quod me, ad quem missus es, ignoras, minus miror, cum te fortunam eius, a quo venis, ignorare cernam.

[4] Lysimachia tenenda erat, ne Chersonesum intraremus, aut ad Hellespontum obsistendum, ne in ¹ Asiam traiceremus, si pacem tamquam ab sollicitis de belli eventu petituri eratis:

[5] concesso vero in Asiam transitu et non solum frenis, sed etiam iugo accepto quae disceptatio ex aequo, cum imperium patiendum sit, relicta est?

[6] ego ex munificentia regia maximum donum filium habebo; aliis, deos precor, ne umquam fortuna egeat mea;

[7] animus certe non egebit. pro tanto in me munere gratum me in se esse sentiet, si privatam gratiam pro privato beneficio desiderabit; publice nec habebo quicquam ab illo nec dabo.

[8] quod in praesentia dare possim, fidele consilium est. abi, nuntia meis verbis, bello absistat, pacis condicionem nullam recuset.

[9] ” nihil ea moverunt regem, tutam fore belli aleam ratum, quando perinde ac victo iam sibi leges dicerentur. omissa igitur in praesentia mentione pacis totam curam in belli apparatum intendit.

Translations (2)

History of Rome Perseus (Spillan, D.; Edmonds, Cyrus; McDevitte, William A., translators. London: Henry G. Bohn, 1849-1868. (Bohn's Classical Library)) — 37.36 focus

[1]

The ambassador, after he came to the conclusion that lie could obtain no reasonable terms in the council, tried to influence the mind of Publius Scipio in private (for such were his orders). First of all he told him that the king would restore him his son without a ransom;

[2] and then, as ignorant of the disposition of Scipio as he was of the Roman manners, he promised an immense weight of gold, and, excepting the title of king, an absolute partnership in the sovereignty, if through his means he should obtain a peace.

[3] To which Scipio answered,

I am the less surprised that you are ignorant of the Romans in general, and of me, to

[4]

whom you have been sent, when I see that you are unacquainted with the situation even of the person from whom you come.

[5]

You ought to have kept Lysimachia to prevent our entering the Chersonese, or to have opposed us at the Hellespont to hinder our passing into Asia, if you meant to ask peace from us as from people solicitous about the issue of war. But after leaving the passage into Asia open, and receiving not only a bridle, but also a yoke, what negotiation on an equality has been left you, when you must submit to orders?

[6]

I shall consider my son as a very great gift from the munificence of the king; I pray to the gods that my circumstances may never require others, my mind certainly never will require any.

[7]

For such an act of generosity to me he shall find me grateful, if for a personal favour he will accept a personal return of gratitude. In my public capacity, I will neither accept from him nor give him any thing. All that I can give at present is sincere advice.

[8]

Go then, and desire him in my name, to cease hostilities, and to refuse no terms of peace.

[9] These words had no effect on the king, who thought that the chance of war would be comparatively safe, since terms were dictated to him already as if he were totally vanquished. Laying aside, therefore, for the present, all farther mention of peace, he turned his whole attention to the preparations for war.

History of Rome Perseus (Volumes 1-2. Roberts, Canon, Rev, translator. London, New York: J. M. Dent and Sons; E. P. Dutton and Co., 1912.) — 37.36 focus

[1]

The envoy came to the conclusion that, as far as the council was concerned, he was not obtaining any reasonable terms, and in accordance with his instructions he tried what he could do with Scipio in a private interview.

[2] He began by telling him that the king would restore his son without ransom, and then, ignorant alike of Scipio's character and Roman usage, he held out to him the offer of an enormous bribe if he obtained peace through his instrumentality, and also a full share in the sovereign power, with the sole exception of the royal title.

[3] Scipio replied: "Your ignorance of the Romans as a whole, and of me in particular to whom you have been

[4] sent, is the less surprising when I see that you are ignorant of the situation of the man from whom you have come.

[5] You ought to have held Lysimachia to prevent our entering the Chersonese, or else you ought to have opposed us at the Hellespont to prevent our passing into Asia, if you intended to ask for peace from us as from those who were anxious about the issue of the war. But now that you have left the passage into Asia open and have accepted not only the bit but the yoke as well, what room is there for any discussion on equal terms, since you will have to submit to our sovereignty?

[6] I shall look upon my son as the greatest gift which the king's generosity could bestow; as to his other offers, I pray heaven my circumstances may never be in need of them, my mind at all events never will.

[7] In my public capacity as representing the State I will neither take anything from him nor give him anything. What I can give now is sincere advice.

[8] Go and tell him in my name to abandon hostilities and accept any terms of peace that may be offered." These words did not influence the king in the least, he regarded his chances in war as

[9] quite safe, and this too at the very time when terms were proposed to him as though he were already vanquished. For the present, therefore, he dropped all mention of peace, and devoted all his care to preparing for war.

Notes on the current edition

Ab Urbe Condita With An English Translation, books 1-10, 21-45, with periochae 11-20

1. B.C. 190

2. Livy has been at some pains to portray in this speech the incorruptible Roman, who will, while he accepts, allow not even the greatest private obligation to influence his public conduct. The rest of this narrative, save for this interpretation, is found in Polybius (XXI. xv).

3. Antiochus had now nothing to lose by fighting, since the terms of peace were already as severe as they were ever likely to be.

Titus Livius (Livy) Ab urbe condita 37.36

Benjamin Oliver Foster, Ph.D. (Editor), Frank Gardener Moore (Editor), Evan T. Sage, Ph.D. (Editor), Alfred C. Schlesinger, Ph.D. (Editor)

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