Lucian, Hermotimus, Henry Watson Fowler (Translator), Francis George Fowler (Translator), 37

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[37]

Hermotimus

It seems to me, Lycinus, you do not understand what I mean.

Lycinus

Very well, put it plainer, if it is something different from that.

Hermotimus

You will see in a minute. Let us suppose two people have gone into the temple of Asclepius or Dionysus, and subsequently one of the sacred cups is missing. Both of them will have to be searched, to see which has it about him.

Lycinus

Clearly.

Hermotimus

Of course one of them has it.

Lycinus

Necessarily, if it is missing.

Hermotimus

Then, if you find it on the first, you will not strip the other; it is clear he has not got it..

Lycinus

Quite.

Hermotimus

And if we fail to find it on the first, the other certainly has it; it is unnecessary to search him that way either.

Lycinus

Yes, he has it.

Hermotimus

So with us; if we find the cup in the possession of the Stoics, we shall not care to go on and search the others; we have what we were looking for; why trouble further?

Hermotimus. Lucian. Henry Watson Fowler (Translator), Francis George Fowler (Translator). Medford, MA, USA. 2023-08-01.

Current edition Perseus

Hermotimus, or the Rival Philosophies (English) (The Works of Lucian of Samosata, Vol. 2. Fowler, Henry Watson and Fowler, Francis George, translators. Oxford: Clarendon Press, 1905.)

Editions (2)

Ἑρμότιμος ἢ Περὶ Αἱρέσεων Perseus (Lucian. Luciani Samosatensis Opera, Vol. 1. Jacobitz, Karl, editor. Leipzig: Teubner, 1909.) — 37 focus

Ἑρμότιμος

οὔ μοι δοκεῖς, ὦ Λυκῖνε, ξυνιέναι πῶς 780 βούλομαι εἰπεῖν.

Λυκῖνος

οὐκοῦν σαφέστερον χρὴ λέγειν εἰ ἑτεροῖόν τι, ἀλλὰ μὴ τοιοῦτον φήσεις.

Ἑρμότιμος

εἴσῃ αὐτίκα οἷόν τι λέγω. θῶμεν γάρ τινας δύο ἐσεληλυθέναι ἐς τὸ Ἀσκληπιεῖον ἢ ἐς τοῦ Διονύσου τὸ ἱερόν, εἶτα μέντοι φιάλην τινὰ τῶν ἱερῶν ἀπολωλέναι. δεήσει δή που ἀμφοτέρους ἐρευνηθῆναι αὐτούς, ὁπότερος ὑπὸ κόλπου ἔχει τὴν φιάλην.

Λυκῖνος

καὶ μάλα.

Ἑρμότιμος

ἔχει δὲ πάντως ὁ ἕτερος.

Λυκῖνος

πῶς γὰρ οὔ, εἴ γε ἀπόλωλεν;

Ἑρμότιμος

οὐκοῦν ἂν παρὰ τῷ προτέρῳ εὕρῃς αὐτήν, οὐκέτι τὸν ἕτερον ἀποδύσεις· πρόδηλον γὰρ ὡς οὐκ ἔχει.

Λυκῖνος

πρόδηλον γάρ.

Ἑρμότιμος

καὶ εἴ γε μὴ εὕροιμεν ἐν τῷ τοῦ προτέρου κόλπῳ, ὁ ἕτερος πάντως ἔχει, καὶ οὐδὲν ἐρεύνης οὐδὲ οὕτως δεῖ.

Λυκῖνος

ἔχει γάρ.

Ἑρμότιμος

καὶ ἡμεῖς τοίνυν εἰ εὕροιμεν ἤδη παρὰ τοῖς Στωϊκοῖς τὴν φιάλην, οὐκέτι ἐρευνᾶν τοὺς ἄλλους ἀξιώσομεν ἔχοντες ὃ πάλαι ἐζητοῦμεν. ἢ τίνος γὰρ ἂν ἕνεκα ἔτι κάμνοιμεν;

Σκύθης ἢ πρόξενος Perseus (Lucian, Vol. 6. Kilburn, Kenneth, editor. London: William Heinemann, Ltd.; Cambridge, MA: Harvard University Press, 1959 (unrenewed copyright).) — 37 focus

ΕΡΜΟΤΙΜΟΣ

Οὔ μοι δοκεῖς, ὦ Λυκῖνε, ξυνιέναι πῶς βούλομαι εἰπεῖν.

ΛΥΚΙΝΟΣ

Οὐκοῦν σαφέστερον χρὴ λέγειν εἰ ἑτεροῖόν τι ἀλλὰ μὴ τοιοῦτον φήσεις.

ΕΡΜΟΤΙΜΟΣ

Εἴσῃ αὐτίκα οἷόν τι λέγω. θῶμεν γάρ τινας δύο ἐσεληλυθέναι ἐς τὸ Ἀσκληπιεῖον ἢ ἐς τοῦ Διονύσου τὸ ἱερόν, εἶτα μέντοι φιάλην τινὰ τῶν ἱερῶν ἀπολωλέναι. δεήσει δή που ἀμφοτέρους ἐρευνηθῆναι αὐτοὺς ὁπότερος ὑπὸ κόλπου ἔχει τὴν φιάλην.

ΛΥΚΙΝΟΣ

Καὶ μάλα.

ΕΡΜΟΤΙΜΟΣ

Ἔχει δὲ πάντως ὁ ἕτερος.

ΛΥΚΙΝΟΣ

Πῶς γὰρ οὔ, εἴ γε ἀπόλωλεν;

ΕΡΜΟΤΙΜΟΣ

Οὐκοῦν ἂν παρὰ τῷ προτέρῳ εὕρῃς αὐτήν, οὐκέτι τὸν ἕτερον ἀποδύσεις. πρόδηλον γὰρ ὡς οὐκ ἔχει.

ΛΥΚΙΝΟΣ

Πρόδηλον γάρ.

ΕΡΜΟΤΙΜΟΣ

Καὶ εἴ γε μὴ εὕροιμεν ἐν τῷ τοῦ προτέρου κόλπῳ ὁ ἕτερος πάντως ἔχει, καὶ οὐδὲν ἐρεύνης οὐδὲ οὕτως δεῖ.

ΛΥΚΙΝΟΣ

Ἔχει γάρ.

ΕΡΜΟΤΙΜΟΣ

Καὶ ἡμεῖς τοίνυν εἰ εὕροιμεν ἤδη παρὰ τοῖς Στωϊκοῖς τὴν φιάλην, οὐκέτι ἐρευνᾶν τοὺς ἄλλους ἀξιώσομεν ἔχοντες ὃ πάλαι ἐζητοῦμεν. ἢ τίνος γὰρ ἂν ἕνεκα ἔτι κάμνοιμεν;

Translations (1)

The Scythian or Consul Perseus (Lucian, Vol. 6. Kilburn, Kenneth, translator. London: William Heinemann, Ltd.; Cambridge, MA: Harvard University Press, 1959 (unrenewed copyright).) — 37 focus

HERMOTIMUS

It seems to me, Lycinus, that you do not understand what I mean.

LYCINUS

Then you must speak more clearly, if your argument is to be different from what I say.

HERMOTIMUS

You will learn at once what I mean. Let us suppose that two persons have entered the Asclepieum or the sanctuary of Dionysus, and that subsequently one of the sacred chalices is missing. It will without doubt be necessary to search both of them to find out which one of the two has the chalice in his clothing.

LYCINUS

Very true.

HERMOTIMUS

One of them surely has it.

LYCINUS

Of course, if it has disappeared.

HERMOTIMUS

And if you discover it on the first, you will not strip the other. It will be quite clear that he has not got it.

LYCINUS

Quite clear.

HERMOTIMUS

And if we were not to find it in the first one’s clothing, the second man surely has it, and there is in this case too no need of a search.

LYCINUS

Yes, he has it.

HERMOTIMUS

So too in our case. Suppose we find the chalice already in the hands of the Stoics, we shall not bother to search the others, since we have what we have been looking for for a long time. Why should we trouble further?

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Current edition Perseus

Ἑρμότιμος οὔ μοι δοκεῖς, ὦ Λυκῖνε, ξυνιέναι πῶς 780 βούλομαι εἰπεῖν.

Λυκῖνος οὐκοῦν σαφέστερον χρὴ λέγειν εἰ ἑτεροῖόν τι, ἀλλὰ μὴ τοιοῦτον φήσεις.

Λυκῖνος καὶ μάλα.

Ἑρμότιμος ἔχει δὲ πάντως ὁ ἕτερος.

Λυκῖνος πῶς γὰρ οὔ, εἴ γε ἀπόλωλεν;

Ἑρμότιμος οὐκοῦν ἂν παρὰ τῷ προτέρῳ εὕρῃς αὐτήν, οὐκέτι τὸν ἕτερον ἀποδύσεις· πρόδηλον γὰρ ὡς οὐκ ἔχει.

Λυκῖνος πρόδηλον γάρ.

Ἑρμότιμος καὶ εἴ γε μὴ εὕροιμεν ἐν τῷ τοῦ προτέρου κόλπῳ, ὁ ἕτερος πάντως ἔχει, καὶ οὐδὲν ἐρεύνης οὐδὲ οὕτως δεῖ.

Λυκῖνος ἔχει γάρ.

ΕΡΜΟΤΙΜΟΣ Οὔ μοι δοκεῖς, ὦ Λυκῖνε, ξυνιέναι πῶς βούλομαι εἰπεῖν.

ΛΥΚΙΝΟΣ Οὐκοῦν σαφέστερον χρὴ λέγειν εἰ ἑτεροῖόν τι ἀλλὰ μὴ τοιοῦτον φήσεις.

ΛΥΚΙΝΟΣ Καὶ μάλα.

ΕΡΜΟΤΙΜΟΣ Ἔχει δὲ πάντως ὁ ἕτερος.

ΛΥΚΙΝΟΣ Πῶς γὰρ οὔ, εἴ γε ἀπόλωλεν;

ΕΡΜΟΤΙΜΟΣ Οὐκοῦν ἂν παρὰ τῷ προτέρῳ εὕρῃς αὐτήν, οὐκέτι τὸν ἕτερον ἀποδύσεις. πρόδηλον γὰρ ὡς οὐκ ἔχει.

ΛΥΚΙΝΟΣ Πρόδηλον γάρ.

ΕΡΜΟΤΙΜΟΣ Καὶ εἴ γε μὴ εὕροιμεν ἐν τῷ τοῦ προτέρου κόλπῳ ὁ ἕτερος πάντως ἔχει, καὶ οὐδὲν ἐρεύνης οὐδὲ οὕτως δεῖ.

ΛΥΚΙΝΟΣ Ἔχει γάρ.

HERMOTIMUS It seems to me, Lycinus, that you do not understand what I mean.

LYCINUS Then you must speak more clearly, if your argument is to be different from what I say.

LYCINUS Very true.

HERMOTIMUS One of them surely has it.

LYCINUS Of course, if it has disappeared.

HERMOTIMUS And if you discover it on the first, you will not strip the other. It will be quite clear that he has not got it.

LYCINUS Quite clear.

HERMOTIMUS And if we were not to find it in the first one’s clothing, the second man surely has it, and there is in this case too no need of a search.

LYCINUS Yes, he has it.

HERMOTIMUS So too in our case. Suppose we find the chalice already in the hands of the Stoics, we shall not bother to search the others, since we have what we have been looking for for a long time. Why should we trouble further?

Stable identifiers

Ἑρμότιμος

οὔ μοι δοκεῖς, ὦ Λυκῖνε, ξυνιέναι πῶς 780 βούλομαι εἰπεῖν.

Λυκῖνος

οὐκοῦν σαφέστερον χρὴ λέγειν εἰ ἑτεροῖόν τι, ἀλλὰ μὴ τοιοῦτον φήσεις.

Λυκῖνος

καὶ μάλα.

Ἑρμότιμος

ἔχει δὲ πάντως ὁ ἕτερος.

Λυκῖνος

πῶς γὰρ οὔ, εἴ γε ἀπόλωλεν;

Ἑρμότιμος

οὐκοῦν ἂν παρὰ τῷ προτέρῳ εὕρῃς αὐτήν, οὐκέτι τὸν ἕτερον ἀποδύσεις· πρόδηλον γὰρ ὡς οὐκ ἔχει.

Λυκῖνος

πρόδηλον γάρ.

Ἑρμότιμος

καὶ εἴ γε μὴ εὕροιμεν ἐν τῷ τοῦ προτέρου κόλπῳ, ὁ ἕτερος πάντως ἔχει, καὶ οὐδὲν ἐρεύνης οὐδὲ οὕτως δεῖ.

Λυκῖνος

ἔχει γάρ.

ΕΡΜΟΤΙΜΟΣ

Οὔ μοι δοκεῖς, ὦ Λυκῖνε, ξυνιέναι πῶς βούλομαι εἰπεῖν.

ΛΥΚΙΝΟΣ

Οὐκοῦν σαφέστερον χρὴ λέγειν εἰ ἑτεροῖόν τι ἀλλὰ μὴ τοιοῦτον φήσεις.

ΛΥΚΙΝΟΣ

Καὶ μάλα.

ΕΡΜΟΤΙΜΟΣ

Ἔχει δὲ πάντως ὁ ἕτερος.

ΛΥΚΙΝΟΣ

Πῶς γὰρ οὔ, εἴ γε ἀπόλωλεν;

ΕΡΜΟΤΙΜΟΣ

Οὐκοῦν ἂν παρὰ τῷ προτέρῳ εὕρῃς αὐτήν, οὐκέτι τὸν ἕτερον ἀποδύσεις. πρόδηλον γὰρ ὡς οὐκ ἔχει.

ΛΥΚΙΝΟΣ

Πρόδηλον γάρ.

ΕΡΜΟΤΙΜΟΣ

Καὶ εἴ γε μὴ εὕροιμεν ἐν τῷ τοῦ προτέρου κόλπῳ ὁ ἕτερος πάντως ἔχει, καὶ οὐδὲν ἐρεύνης οὐδὲ οὕτως δεῖ.

ΛΥΚΙΝΟΣ

Ἔχει γάρ.

HERMOTIMUS

It seems to me, Lycinus, that you do not understand what I mean.

LYCINUS

Then you must speak more clearly, if your argument is to be different from what I say.

LYCINUS

Very true.

HERMOTIMUS

One of them surely has it.

LYCINUS

Of course, if it has disappeared.

HERMOTIMUS

And if you discover it on the first, you will not strip the other. It will be quite clear that he has not got it.

LYCINUS

Quite clear.

HERMOTIMUS

And if we were not to find it in the first one’s clothing, the second man surely has it, and there is in this case too no need of a search.

LYCINUS

Yes, he has it.

HERMOTIMUS

So too in our case. Suppose we find the chalice already in the hands of the Stoics, we shall not bother to search the others, since we have what we have been looking for for a long time. Why should we trouble further?