Lucian, Juppiter Tragoedus, Henry Watson Fowler (Translator), Francis George Fowler (Translator), 35

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Timocles

What, you miscreant, no Gods? no Providence?

Damis

No, no; you answer my question first; what makes you believe in them?

Timocles

None of that, now; the onus probandi is with you, scoundrel.

Damis

None of that, now; it is with you.

Zeus

At this game ours is much the better man—loudervoiced, rougher-tempered. Good, Timocles; stick to invective; that is your strong point; once you get off that, he will hook and hold you up like a fish.

Timocles

I solemnly swear I will not answer first.

Damis

Well, put your questions, then; so much you score by your oath, But xo abuse, please.

Juppiter Tragoedus. Lucian. Henry Watson Fowler (Translator), Francis George Fowler (Translator). Medford, MA, USA. 2023-08-01.

Current edition Perseus

Zeus Tragoedus (English) (The Works of Lucian of Samosata, Vol. 3. Fowler, Henry Watson and Fowler, Francis George, translators. Oxford: Clarendon Press, 1905.)

Editions (1)

Ζεὺς Τραγῳδός Perseus (Lucian, Vol. 2. Harmon, Austin Morris, editor. London: William Heinemann, Ltd.; Cambridge, MA: Harvard University Press, 1915.) — 35 focus

Τιμοκλῆς

τί φής, ὦ ἱερόσυλε Δᾶμι, θεοὺς μὴ εἶναι μηδὲ προνοεῖν τῶν ἀνθρώπων;

Δάμις

οὔκ· ἀλλὰ σὺ πρότερος ἀπόκριναί μοι ᾧτινι λόγῳ ἐπείσθης εἶναι αὐτούς.

Τιμοκλῆς

οὐ μὲν οὖν, ἀλλὰ σύ, ὦ μιαρέ, ἀπόκριναι.

Δάμις

οὐ μὲν οὖν, ἀλλὰ σύ.

Ζεύς

ταυτὶ μὲν παρὰ πολὺ ὁ ἡμέτερος ἄμεινον καὶ εὐφωνότερον τραχύνεται. εὖ γε, ὦ Τιμόκλεις, ἐπίχει τῶν βλασφημιῶν· ἐν γὰρ τούτῳ σοι τὸ κράτος, ὡς τά γε ἄλλα ἰχθύν σε ἀποφανεῖ ἐπιστομίζων.

Τιμοκλῆς

ἀλλά, μὰ τὴν Ἀθηνᾶν, οὐκ ἂν ἀποκριναίμην σοι πρότερος.

Δάμις

οὐκοῦν, ὦ Τιμόκλεις, ἐρώτα· ἐκράτησας γὰρ τοῦτό γε ὀμωμοκώς· ἀλλʼ ἄνευ τῶν βλασφημιῶν, εἰ δοκεῖ.

Translations (2)

Zeus Rants Perseus (Lucian, Vol. 2. Harmon, Austin Morris, editor. London: William Heinemann, Ltd.; Cambridge, MA: Harvard University Press, 1915.) — 35 focus

TIMOCLES

¹ Damis, you sacrilegious wretch, why do you say that the gods do not exist and do not show providence in behalf of men?

DAMIS

No, you tell me first what reason you have for believing that they do exist.

TIMOCLES

No, you tell me, you miscreant!

DAMIS

No, you!

ZEUS

So far our man is much better and more noisy in his bullying. Good, Timocles! Pile on your abuse; that is your strong point, for in everything else he will make you as mute as a fish.

TIMOCLES

But I swear by Athena that I will not answer you first.

DAMIS

Well then, put your question, Timocles, for you have won with that oath of yours. But no abuse, please.

Zeus the Tragedian Perseus (Selections from Lucian. Smith, Emily James, translator. New York: Harper Brothers, 1892.) — 35 focus

Timokles

What is this you say, Damis, you looter of temples? That the gods do not exist or exercise providence for men?

Damis

That is what I say; but do you first answer me, and state what reason you have for believing in their existence.

Timokles

I will not, you wretch. You answer me.

Damis

I will not. Answer yourself.

Zeus

So far our man has been far more successfully and loudly abusive. That's right, Timokles, pour on the abuse. Your strength lies there, since in other lines he stops your mouth and makes you dumb as a fish.

Lucian Juppiter Tragoedus 35

Henry Watson Fowler (Translator), Francis George Fowler (Translator)

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Timocles

What, you miscreant, no Gods? no Providence?

Damis

No, no; you answer my question first; what makes you believe in them?

Timocles

None of that, now; the onus probandi is with you, scoundrel.

Damis

None of that, now; it is with you.

Zeus

At this game ours is much the better man—loudervoiced, rougher-tempered. Good, Timocles; stick to invective; that is your strong point; once you get off that, he will hook and hold you up like a fish.

Timocles

I solemnly swear I will not answer first.

Damis

Well, put your questions, then; so much you score by your oath, But xo abuse, please.

Current edition Perseus

Τιμοκλῆς

τί φής, ὦ ἱερόσυλε Δᾶμι, θεοὺς μὴ εἶναι μηδὲ προνοεῖν τῶν ἀνθρώπων;

Δάμις

οὔκ· ἀλλὰ σὺ πρότερος ἀπόκριναί μοι ᾧτινι λόγῳ ἐπείσθης εἶναι αὐτούς.

Τιμοκλῆς

οὐ μὲν οὖν, ἀλλὰ σύ, ὦ μιαρέ, ἀπόκριναι.

Δάμις

οὐ μὲν οὖν, ἀλλὰ σύ.

Τιμοκλῆς

ἀλλά, μὰ τὴν Ἀθηνᾶν, οὐκ ἂν ἀποκριναίμην σοι πρότερος.

Δάμις

οὐκοῦν, ὦ Τιμόκλεις, ἐρώτα· ἐκράτησας γὰρ τοῦτό γε ὀμωμοκώς· ἀλλʼ ἄνευ τῶν βλασφημιῶν, εἰ δοκεῖ.

TIMOCLES

¹ Damis, you sacrilegious wretch, why do you say that the gods do not exist and do not show providence in behalf of men?

DAMIS

No, you tell me first what reason you have for believing that they do exist.

TIMOCLES

No, you tell me, you miscreant!

DAMIS

No, you!

ZEUS

So far our man is much better and more noisy in his bullying. Good, Timocles! Pile on your abuse; that is your strong point, for in everything else he will make you as mute as a fish.

TIMOCLES

But I swear by Athena that I will not answer you first.

DAMIS

Well then, put your question, Timocles, for you have won with that oath of yours. But no abuse, please.

Timokles

What is this you say, Damis, you looter of temples? That the gods do not exist or exercise providence for men?

Damis

That is what I say; but do you first answer me, and state what reason you have for believing in their existence.

Timokles

I will not, you wretch. You answer me.

Damis

I will not. Answer yourself.

Zeus

So far our man has been far more successfully and loudly abusive. That's right, Timokles, pour on the abuse. Your strength lies there, since in other lines he stops your mouth and makes you dumb as a fish.

Timokles

By Heaven, I will not answer you first if I know it.

Damis

Then put your question, for you beat me that time by swearing. But spare abusive language, if you please.

Stable identifiers

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Timocles What, you miscreant, no Gods? no Providence?

Damis No, no; you answer my question first; what makes you believe in them?

Timocles None of that, now; the onus probandi is with you, scoundrel.

Damis None of that, now; it is with you.

Zeus At this game ours is much the better man—loudervoiced, rougher-tempered. Good, Timocles; stick to invective; that is your strong point; once you get off that, he will hook and hold you up like a fish.

Timocles I solemnly swear I will not answer first.

Damis Well, put your questions, then; so much you score by your oath, But xo abuse, please.

Current edition Perseus

Τιμοκλῆς τί φής, ὦ ἱερόσυλε Δᾶμι, θεοὺς μὴ εἶναι μηδὲ προνοεῖν τῶν ἀνθρώπων;

Δάμις οὔκ· ἀλλὰ σὺ πρότερος ἀπόκριναί μοι ᾧτινι λόγῳ ἐπείσθης εἶναι αὐτούς.

Τιμοκλῆς οὐ μὲν οὖν, ἀλλὰ σύ, ὦ μιαρέ, ἀπόκριναι.

Δάμις οὐ μὲν οὖν, ἀλλὰ σύ.

Τιμοκλῆς ἀλλά, μὰ τὴν Ἀθηνᾶν, οὐκ ἂν ἀποκριναίμην σοι πρότερος.

Δάμις οὐκοῦν, ὦ Τιμόκλεις, ἐρώτα· ἐκράτησας γὰρ τοῦτό γε ὀμωμοκώς· ἀλλʼ ἄνευ τῶν βλασφημιῶν, εἰ δοκεῖ.

TIMOCLES 1 Damis, you sacrilegious wretch, why do you say that the gods do not exist and do not show providence in behalf of men?

DAMIS No, you tell me first what reason you have for believing that they do exist.

TIMOCLES No, you tell me, you miscreant!

DAMIS No, you!

ZEUS So far our man is much better and more noisy in his bullying. Good, Timocles! Pile on your abuse; that is your strong point, for in everything else he will make you as mute as a fish.

TIMOCLES But I swear by Athena that I will not answer you first.

DAMIS Well then, put your question, Timocles, for you have won with that oath of yours. But no abuse, please.

Timokles What is this you say, Damis, you looter of temples? That the gods do not exist or exercise providence for men?

Damis That is what I say; but do you first answer me, and state what reason you have for believing in their existence.

Timokles I will not, you wretch. You answer me.

Damis I will not. Answer yourself.

Zeus So far our man has been far more successfully and loudly abusive. That's right, Timokles, pour on the abuse. Your strength lies there, since in other lines he stops your mouth and makes you dumb as a fish.

Timokles By Heaven, I will not answer you first if I know it.

Damis Then put your question, for you beat me that time by swearing. But spare abusive language, if you please.

Stable identifiers

Timocles

What, you miscreant, no Gods? no Providence?

Damis

No, no; you answer my question first; what makes you believe in them?

Timocles

None of that, now; the onus probandi is with you, scoundrel.

Damis

None of that, now; it is with you.

Zeus

At this game ours is much the better man—loudervoiced, rougher-tempered. Good, Timocles; stick to invective; that is your strong point; once you get off that, he will hook and hold you up like a fish.

Timocles

I solemnly swear I will not answer first.

Damis

Well, put your questions, then; so much you score by your oath, But xo abuse, please.

Τιμοκλῆς

τί φής, ὦ ἱερόσυλε Δᾶμι, θεοὺς μὴ εἶναι μηδὲ προνοεῖν τῶν ἀνθρώπων;

Δάμις

οὔκ· ἀλλὰ σὺ πρότερος ἀπόκριναί μοι ᾧτινι λόγῳ ἐπείσθης εἶναι αὐτούς.

Τιμοκλῆς

οὐ μὲν οὖν, ἀλλὰ σύ, ὦ μιαρέ, ἀπόκριναι.

Δάμις

οὐ μὲν οὖν, ἀλλὰ σύ.

Τιμοκλῆς

ἀλλά, μὰ τὴν Ἀθηνᾶν, οὐκ ἂν ἀποκριναίμην σοι πρότερος.

Δάμις

οὐκοῦν, ὦ Τιμόκλεις, ἐρώτα· ἐκράτησας γὰρ τοῦτό γε ὀμωμοκώς· ἀλλʼ ἄνευ τῶν βλασφημιῶν, εἰ δοκεῖ.

TIMOCLES

¹ Damis, you sacrilegious wretch, why do you say that the gods do not exist and do not show providence in behalf of men?

DAMIS

No, you tell me first what reason you have for believing that they do exist.

TIMOCLES

No, you tell me, you miscreant!

DAMIS

No, you!

ZEUS

So far our man is much better and more noisy in his bullying. Good, Timocles! Pile on your abuse; that is your strong point, for in everything else he will make you as mute as a fish.

TIMOCLES

But I swear by Athena that I will not answer you first.

DAMIS

Well then, put your question, Timocles, for you have won with that oath of yours. But no abuse, please.

Timokles

What is this you say, Damis, you looter of temples? That the gods do not exist or exercise providence for men?

Damis

That is what I say; but do you first answer me, and state what reason you have for believing in their existence.

Timokles

I will not, you wretch. You answer me.

Damis

I will not. Answer yourself.

Zeus

So far our man has been far more successfully and loudly abusive. That's right, Timokles, pour on the abuse. Your strength lies there, since in other lines he stops your mouth and makes you dumb as a fish.

Timokles

By Heaven, I will not answer you first if I know it.

Damis

Then put your question, for you beat me that time by swearing. But spare abusive language, if you please.