Plato, Republic, Paul Shorey (Translator), 10.620

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[620] For he said that it was a sight worth seeing to observe how the several souls selected their lives. 620a He said it was a strange, pitiful, and ridiculous spectacle, as the choice was determined for the most part by the habits of their former lives.¹ He saw the soul that had been Orpheus’, he said, selecting the life of a swan,² because from hatred of the tribe of women, owing to his death at their hands, it was unwilling to be conceived and born of a woman. He saw the soul of Thamyras³ choosing the life of a nightingale; and he saw a swan changing to the choice of the life of man, and similarly other musical animals. 620b The soul that drew the twentieth lot chose the life of a lion; it was the soul of Ajax, the son of Telamon, which, because it remembered the adjudication of the arms of Achilles, was unwilling to become a man. The next, the soul of Agamemnon, likewise from hatred of the human race because of its sufferings, substituted the life of an eagle.⁴ Drawing one of the middle lots the soul of Atalanta caught sight of the great honors attached to an athlete’s life and could not pass them by but snatched at them. 620c After her, he said, he saw the soul of Epeius,⁵ the son of Panopeus, entering into the nature of an arts and crafts woman. Far off in the rear he saw the soul of the buffoon Thersites⁶ clothing itself in the body of an ape. And it fell out that the soul of Odysseus drew the last lot of all and came to make its choice, and, from memory of its former toils having flung away ambition, went about for a long time in quest of the life of an ordinary citizen who minded his own business,⁷ and with difficulty found it lying in some corner disregarded by the others, 620d and upon seeing it said that it would have done the same had it drawn the first lot, and chose it gladly. And in like manner, of the other beasts some entered into men⁸ and into one another, the unjust into wild creatures, the just transformed to tame, and there was every kind of mixture and combination. But when, to conclude, all the souls had chosen their lives in the order of their lots, they were marshalled and went before Lachesis. And she sent with each, 620e as the guardian of his life and the fulfiller of his choice, the genius⁹ that he had chosen, and this divinity led the soul first to Clotho, under her hand and her turning¹⁰ of the spindle to ratify the destiny of his lot and choice; and after contact with her the genius again led the soul to the spinning of Atropos¹¹ to make the web of its destiny¹² irreversible,

Republic. Plato. Paul Shorey (Translator). Cambridge, MA. 1935-37.

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Current edition Perseus

Republic (English) (Plato in Twelve Volumes, Vol. 5-6. Shorey, Paul, translator. Cambridge, MA, Harvard University Press; London, William Heinemann Ltd. 1935-37 (printing).)

Editions (1)

Πολιτεία Perseus (Platonis Opera Tomus IV: Tetralogia VIII. Burnet, John, editor. Oxford: Clarendon Press, 1905.) — 10.620 focus

[620]
ταύτην γὰρ δὴ ἔφη τὴν θέαν ἀξίαν εἶναι ἰδεῖν, ὡς ἕκασται 620a αἱ ψυχαὶ ᾑροῦντο τοὺς βίους· ἐλεινήν τε γὰρ ἰδεῖν εἶναι καὶ γελοίαν καὶ θαυμασίαν. κατὰ συνήθειαν γὰρ τοῦ προτέρου βίου τὰ πολλὰ αἱρεῖσθαι. ἰδεῖν μὲν γὰρ ψυχὴν ἔφη τήν ποτε Ὀρφέως γενομένην κύκνου βίον αἱρουμένην, μίσει τοῦ γυναικείου γένους διὰ τὸν ὑπʼ ἐκείνων θάνατον οὐκ ἐθέλουσαν ἐν γυναικὶ γεννηθεῖσαν γενέσθαι· ἰδεῖν δὲ τὴν Θαμύρου ἀηδόνος ἑλομένην· ἰδεῖν δὲ καὶ κύκνον μεταβάλλοντα εἰς ἀνθρωπίνου βίου αἵρεσιν, καὶ ἄλλα ζῷα μουσικὰ ὡσαύτως. 620b εἰκοστὴν δὲ λαχοῦσαν ψυχὴν ἑλέσθαι λέοντος βίον· εἶναι δὲ τὴν Αἴαντος τοῦ Τελαμωνίου, φεύγουσαν ἄνθρωπον γενέσθαι, μεμνημένην τῆς τῶν ὅπλων κρίσεως. τὴν δʼ ἐπὶ τούτῳ Ἀγαμέμνονος· ἔχθρᾳ δὲ καὶ ταύτην τοῦ ἀνθρωπίνου γένους διὰ τὰ πάθη ἀετοῦ διαλλάξαι βίον. ἐν μέσοις δὲ λαχοῦσαν τὴν Ἀταλάντης ψυχήν, κατιδοῦσαν μεγάλας τιμὰς ἀθλητοῦ ἀνδρός, οὐ δύνασθαι παρελθεῖν, ἀλλὰ λαβεῖν. μετὰ 620c δὲ ταύτην ἰδεῖν τὴν Ἐπειοῦ τοῦ Πανοπέως εἰς τεχνικῆς γυναικὸς ἰοῦσαν φύσιν· πόρρω δʼ ἐν ὑστάτοις ἰδεῖν τὴν τοῦ γελωτοποιοῦ Θερσίτου πίθηκον ἐνδυομένην. κατὰ τύχην δὲ τὴν Ὀδυσσέως λαχοῦσαν πασῶν ὑστάτην αἱρησομένην ἰέναι, μνήμῃ δὲ τῶν προτέρων πόνων φιλοτιμίας λελωφηκυῖαν ζητεῖν περιιοῦσαν χρόνον πολὺν βίον ἀνδρὸς ἰδιώτου ἀπράγμονος, καὶ μόγις εὑρεῖν κείμενόν που καὶ παρημελημένον 620d ὑπὸ τῶν ἄλλων, καὶ εἰπεῖν ἰδοῦσαν ὅτι τὰ αὐτὰ ἂν ἔπραξεν καὶ πρώτη λαχοῦσα, καὶ ἁσμένην ἑλέσθαι. καὶ ἐκ τῶν ἄλλων δὴ θηρίων ὡσαύτως εἰς ἀνθρώπους ἰέναι καὶ εἰς ἄλληλα, τὰ μὲν ἄδικα εἰς τὰ ἄγρια, τὰ δὲ δίκαια εἰς τὰ ἥμερα μεταβάλλοντα, καὶ πάσας μείξεις μείγνυσθαι.
ἐπειδὴ δʼ οὖν πάσας τὰς ψυχὰς τοὺς βίους ᾑρῆσθαι, ὥσπερ ἔλαχον ἐν τάξει προσιέναι πρὸς τὴν Λάχεσιν· ἐκείνην δʼ ἑκάστῳ ὃν εἵλετο δαίμονα, τοῦτον φύλακα συμπέμπειν 620e τοῦ βίου καὶ ἀποπληρωτὴν τῶν αἱρεθέντων. ὃν πρῶτον μὲν ἄγειν αὐτὴν πρὸς τὴν Κλωθὼ ὑπὸ τὴν ἐκείνης χεῖρά τε καὶ ἐπιστροφὴν τῆς τοῦ ἀτράκτου δίνης, κυροῦντα ἣν λαχὼν εἵλετο μοῖραν· ταύτης δʼ ἐφαψάμενον αὖθις ἐπὶ τὴν τῆς Ἀτρόπου ἄγειν νῆσιν, ἀμετάστροφα τὰ ἐπικλωσθέντα ποιοῦντα·

Notes on the current edition

Republic

1. Cf. Phaedo 81 E ff., Phaedr. 248-249, Tim. 42 A-D, 91 D ff. For the idea of reincarnation in Plato see What Plato Said, p. 529, on Phaedo 81 E-82 B.

2. Urwiek, The Message of Plato, p. 213, says:

If Plato knew anything at all of Indian allegory, he must have known that the swan (Hamsa) is in Hinduism the invariable symbol of the immortal Spirit; and to say, as he does, that Orpheus chose the life of a swan, refusing to be born again of a woman, is just an allegorical way of saying that he passed on into the spiritual life. . . .

3. Like Orpheus a singer. He contended with the Muses in song and was in consequence deprived by them of sight and of the gift of song. Cf. also Ion 533 B-C, Laws 829 D-E, Iliad ii. 595.

4. Cf. Aesch. Ag. 114 ff.

5. Who built the Trojan horse. See Hesychius s. v.

6. Cf. Iliad ii. 212 ff.

7. For ἀπράγμονος cf. on 565 A, p. 316, note b.

8. Phaedr. 249 specifies that only beasts who had once been men could return to human form.

9. Cf. 617 E, and for daemons in Plato What Plato Said, pp. 546-547, on Symp. 202 E, Dieterich, Nekyia, p. 59.

10. δίνης: Cf. Cratyl. 439 C and Phaedo 99 B.

11. Cf. Laws 960 C.

12. τὰ ἐπικλωσθέντα: Cf. Laws 957 E, Theaet. 169 C, and the Platonic epigram on Dion, Anth. Pal. vii. 99

Μοῖραι ἐπέκλωσαν

, Od. i. 17, iii. 208, etc., Aesch. Eumen. 335, Callinus i. 9

Μοῖραι ἐπικλώσως

Commentary

Commentary on Plato, Republic (Plato. The Republic, Vol 1-2. Adam, James, editor. Cambridge: Cambridge University Press, 1902-1903.) focus

κατὰ συνήθειαν κτλ. Cf. Phaed. 81 E ff. ἐνδοῦνται δέ, ὥσπερ εἰκός, εἰς τοιαῦτα ἤθη, ὁποἶ ἄττ’ ἂν μεμελητηκυῖαι τύχωσιν ἐν τῷ βίῳ κτλ.

Θαμύρου . Thamyris and not Thamyras was the usual form of this name, but Plato prefers Θαμύρας: cf. lon 533 C ἢ περὶ Θαμύρου ἢ περὶ Ὀρφέως, Laws 829 E τῶν Θαμύρου τε καὶ Ὀρφείων ὕμνων. The meaning of τὰ πολλά (‘for the most part’) will be seen from the case of Odysseus below (620 C f.).

ὡσαύτως. εἰκοστὴν κτλ. The reading εἰκοστήν is confirmed by Plut. Conv. Disp. VIII 5. 739 E ff. ( διὰ τί Πλάτων εἰκοστὴν ἔφη ψυχην τοῦ Αἴαντος ἐπὶ τὸν κλῆρον ἐλθεῖν;) as well as by Proclus l.c. 265. 20 and elsewhere. It appears from these passages that some of the ancients found a subtle significance in εἰκοστήν: but the particular number is probably only a circumstantial detail intended to add verisimilitude to the narrative. See also on 614 B. Herwerden conjectures ὡσαύτως, ὡς τὸ <εἰκός· ....> εἰκοστὴν δὲ κτλ., and inserts between εἰκός and εἰκοστήν the words καὶ ἐκ τῶν ἄλλων—μίγνυσθαι from 620 D. There is however nothing to indicate that the text has suffered dislocation: see on 620 D below.

λέοντος βίον . Ettig ( Acheruntica l.c. p. 310) explains the choice of Ajax by referring to Tim. 91 E τὸ δ’ αὖ πεζὸν καὶ θηριῶδες γέγονεν ἐκ τῶν μηδὲν προσχρωμένων φιλοσοφίᾳ, but the conspicuous feature in Ajax was θυμός, and that is why he selects the life which typifies τὸ θυμοειδές: see IX 588 E. Cf. Proclus l.c. 316. 31 ff. ἡ μὲν Αἴαντος ψυχὴ πᾶσαν δηλοῖ ζωὴν ἀνδρικὴν μέν, πλεονάζουσαν δὲ κατὰ τὸν θυμὸν διὰ δή τινα φιλόνικον ψυχῆς ἕξιν, καὶ διὰ ταύτην ἐνδυομένην εἰς ἀνδρικὸν μὲν ζῷον, ἄλογον δέ. Empedocles, as we are told, held τὴν ἀρίστην εἶναι μετοίκησιν τὴν τοῦ ἀνθρώπου, εἰ μὲν εἰς ζῷον ἡ λῆξις αὐτὸν μεταγάγοι, λέοντα γίγνεσθαι, εἰ δὲ εἰς φυτόν, δάφνην (Ael. Hist. An. XII 7): see Karsten on vv. 382 ff. of the περὶ φύσεως.

Θερσίτου . Thersites is the type of the πονηρὸς ἰδιώτης in Gorg. 525 E . Here, as often in later Greek writers, he stands for the buffoon ( παγγέλοιος ἄνθρωπος διάστροφος τὸ σῶμα καὶ λελωβημένος Lucian adv. ind. 7). Cf. also Soph. Phil. 442 ff., Theopomp. Fr. 262 in Müller Fr. Hist. Gr. I p. 323 and Pythag. Simil. 32 in Mullach Fr. Phil. Gr. I p. 489, in the last of which passages Thersites and Achilles stand for two opposite types. The different varieties of lives which are illustrated in this passage ( μουσικός, πολεμικός, βασιλικός, γυμναστικός, τεχνικός, μιμητικός) appear also (as Proclus observes l.c. 319. 25 ff.) in Phaedr. 248 D , E. See also Empedocles vv. 384—386 and Karsten ad loc.

πίθηκον . Cf. IX 590 B.

ἀπράγμονος . Eusebius ( Praep. Ev. XIII 16. 11) has καὶ ἀπράγμονος, which occurs also in one of the Vatican MSS. Cobet would alter ἀπράγμονος to ἀπράγμονα. The text is quite satisfactory: for ἀνδρὸς ἰδιώτου is virtually a single word: cf. ἀνδρὶ—σοφιστῇ Prot. 312 C , ὑπὲρ ἀνδρὸς θητὸς ἄνδρα πρεσβύτην πατέρα Euthyph. 15 D , ἀνὴρ μάντις, ἀνὴρ νομεύς, ἄνδρες δικασταί and the like. “Sunt ἰδιῶται πολυπράγμονες: Ulyssis anima vitam ἀνδρὸς ἰδιώτου e numero τῶν ἀπραγμόνων quaerebat” (Schneider).

καὶ ἐκ τῶν ἄλλων ‐‐ μίγνυσθαι . See on 620 B. Herwerden's transposition is the less defensible because the words καὶ πάσας μίξεις μίγνυσθαι form an appropriate ending to this part of the picture.

τὰ μὲν ἄδικα κτλ. Cf. (with J. and C.) Phaed. 82 A τοὺς δέ γε ἀδικίας τε καὶ τυραννίδας καὶ ἁρπαγὰς προτετιμηκότας εἰς τὰ τῶν λύκων τε καὶ ἱεράκων καὶ ἰκτίνων γένη κτλ.

πρὸς τὴν Λάχεσιν κτλ. For Lachesis see on 617 C, D, and for δαίμονα 617 D, E notes

ἣν ‐‐ μοῖραν . In λαχών, ἐφαψάμενον and διεξελθόντα the individual himself is substituted for the soul: cf. IX 573 B. Proclus (l.c. 346. 9 ff.) interprets διεξελθόντα of Er, but this cannot be right. λαχών is said with allusion to Λάχεσις, from whose knees the lots were taken (617 D). It is appropriate that Lachesis should be the only Fate involved in the act of choice; for the Future is the child of the Past (cf. 617 C, D note). The selection is then ratified successively by the Fate of the Present, and the Fate of the Future, and finally, by Necessity herself, the mother of all three.

ἀμετάστροφα κτλ. ἀμετάστροφα is said, of course, with reference to the etymological meaning of Ἄτροπος, and ἐπικλωσθέντα in turn alludes to Κλωθώ. In the succeeding clause ἀμεταστρεπτί takes up ἀμετάστροφα again.

Plato Republic 10.620

Paul Shorey (Translator)

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