Homer Iliad 8.469

ed. Robert Southey

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Iliad. Homer. ed. Robert Southey. London. 1847.

Sponsored by Tufts University.

Current edition Experimental

English (William Cowper, 1791, ed. Southey) (OCR draft) (English) (English (William Cowper, 1791, ed. Southey))

Provisional text from uncorrected OCR; expect errors.

Editions (1)
Ἰλιάς Perseus (Homer. Homeri Opera, Volumes 1-2. Monro, D. B. (David Binning), editor; Allen, Thomas W. (Thomas William), editor. Oxford: Clarendon Press, 1908-1920.) — 8.469 focus
Translations (8)
Iliad Perseus (Homer. The Iliad, Volume 1-2. Murray, A. T. (Augustus Taber), translator. London: William Heinmann; New York: G.P. Putnam's Sons, 1924-1925.) — 8.469 focus
Iliad Perseus (Homer. The Iliad of Homer, rendered into English prose for the use of those who cannot read the original. Butler, Samuel, 1835-1902, translator. London: Longmans, Green, and Co, 1898.) — 8.432 focus
English (Butler, rev. Nagy et al., 2020) (OCR draft) Experimental (English (Butler, rev. Nagy et al., 2020)) — 8.469 focus
And Zeus who gathers clouds answered, [470] “Tomorrow morning, ox-vision Hera, if you choose to do so, you will see the son of Kronos destroying large numbers of the Argives, for fierce Hector shall not cease fighting till he has roused the swift-footed son of Peleus [475] when they are fighting in dire straits at their ships’ sterns about the body of fallen Patroklos. Like it or no, this is how it is decreed; for all I care, you may go to the lowest depths beneath earth and sea [ pontos], where Iapetos and Kronos dwell [480] in lone Tartaros with neither ray of light nor breath of wind to cheer them. You may go on and on till you get there, and I shall not care one whit for your displeasure; you are the greatest vixen living.”
English (William Cullen Bryant, 1870) (OCR draft) Experimental (English (William Cullen Bryant, 1870)) — 8.469 focus
And then the Cloud-compeller, answering, said: -
585
"O Juno, large-eyed and august, if thou
Look forth to-morrow, thou shalt then behold
The all-powerful son of Saturn laying waste
With greater havoc still the mighty host
Of warlike Greeks. For Hector, great in war,
590
Shall pause not from the conflict, till he rouse
The swift-paced son of Peleus at the ships,
When, pent in narrow space, the armies fight
For slain Patroclus: such the will of fate.
As for thyself, I little heed thy rage:
595
Not even shouldst thou wander to the realm
Where earth and ocean end, where Saturn sits
Beside Iapetus, and neither light
Of overgoing suns nor breath of wind
Refreshes them, but gulfs of Tartarus
600
Surround them, - shouldst thou even thither bend
Thy way, I shall not heed thy rage, who art
Beyond all others shamelessly perverse."
He ceased; but white-armed Juno answered not.
And now into the sea the sun's bright light
605
Went down, and o'er the foodful earth was drawn
Night's shadow. Most unwillingly the sons
Of Troy beheld the sunset. To the Greeks
Eagerly wished the welcome darkness came.
Then from the fleet illustrious Hector led
610
The Trojans, and beside the eddying stream,
In a clear space uncumbered by the slain,
Held council. There, alighting from their cars,
They listened to the words that Hector spake, —
Hector, beloved of Jove. He held a spear,
615
In length eleven cubits, with a blade
Of glittering brass, bound with a ring of gold.
On this he leaned, and spake these winged words: -
"But now I thought that, having first destroyed
The Achaian host and fleet, we should return
620
This night to wind-swept Ilium. To their aid
The darkness comes, and saves the Greeks, and saves
Their galleys ranged along the ocean-side.
Obey we, then, the dark-browed night; prepare
Our meal; unyoke the steeds with flowing manes,
625
And set their food before them. Bring at once
Oxen and fatlings of the flock from town,
And from your dwellings bread and pleasant wine.
And let us gather store of wood, to feed
A multitude of blazing fires all night,
630
Till Morning, daughter of the Dawn, appear, -
Fires that shall light the sky,
English (Alexander Pope, 1720, ed. Watson, 1857) (OCR draft) Experimental (English (Alexander Pope, 1720, ed. Watson, 1857)) — 8.469 focus
The goddess thus: and thus the god replies,
Who swells the clouds, and blackens all the skies:
585
'The morning sun, awak'd by loud alarms,
'Shall see th' almighty Thunderer in arms.
'What heaps of Argives then shall load the plain,
'Those radiant eyes shall view, and view in vain.
'Nor shall great Hector cease the rage of fight,
590
'The navy flaming, and thy Greeks in flight,
'E'en till the day, when certain fates ordain
'That stern Achilles (his Patroclus slain)
'Shall rise in vengeance, and lay waste the plain.
'For such is fate, nor canst thou turn its course
595
'With all thy rage, with all thy rebel force.
'Fly, if thou wilt, to earth's remotest bound,
'Where on her utmost verge the seas resound;
'Where curs'd Iapetus and Saturn dwell,
'Fast by the brink, within the steams of hell;
600
'No sun e'er gilds the gloomy horrors there,
'No cheerful gales refresh the lazy air:
'There arm once more the bold Titanian band,
'And arm in vain: for what I will shall stand.'
English (Thomas Hobbes, 1667, ed. Molesworth 1843) (OCR draft) Experimental (English (Thomas Hobbes, 1667, ed. Molesworth 1843)) — 8.469 focus
English (George Chapman, 1611, ed. Hooper 1857) (OCR draft) Experimental (English (George Chapman, 1611, ed. Hooper 1857)) — 8.469 focus
English (F. W. Newman, 1856) (OCR draft) Experimental (English (F. W. Newman, 1856)) — 8 focus

New Alexandria Commentaries

Douglas Frame

analysis of Athena’s association with/wearing peplos

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analysis of this passage and I.09.009-078 (assemblies of the Trojans and of the Achaeans, respectively) as an instance of “Zielinski’s law”

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Gregory Nagy

In my comments here on Rhapsody 8, I sense I am not far from reaching a critical mass of details that shed light on the unity and integrity of the Homeric Iliad. With the upcoming comments on Rhapsody 9, this sense will I hope reach a definitive stage.

draft js image error“Hera, Athena, and Iris in the Trojan War,” Jacques Réattu (1760–1833). Image via Wikimedia Commons.

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Hector here is said to be atalantos or ‘equal’ to Ares. This kind of equating of a hero with the war god will figure prominently in future scenes of mortal combat. Relevant are previous scenes of mortal combat involving Diomedes: see the comments at I.05.438, I.05.440–442, I.05.459. Besides Hector, as here at I.08.215 another hero who will be pointedly described as ‘equal to Ares’ is Patroklos. Besides sharing such an epithet, Hector and Patroklos will also be sharing the armor of Achilles: first it is Patroklos who wears this armor when he goes off to fight as a substitute for Achilles; and then Hector will wear it after he kills Patroklos.

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The ships of the Achaeans are beached along the shores of a large U-shaped bay that opens into the Hellespont. See Map 1 and Map 2 at HPC 157 and 158 respectively. Such a bay no longer exists, because of long-term silting from the river Scamander, which emptied into the bay. In the second millennium BCE and even later, however, the bay was very much of a reality, as the maps show, and the visualization in the Homeric Iliad approximates such a topographical reality. This is not to say, however, that we should imagine the ships of the Achaeans as floating at anchor in the waters of such a bay: rather, the Iliad pictures the ships are beached along the shores of the bay, with their sterns facing inland and their prows facing out toward the waters. On this positioning, see also the comment on I.14.027–036. Exploring further the Iliadic visualization, we can see that the beached ship of Odysseus is located at the bottom of the U-shaped bay, at the south in the middle of the bayline, while the beached ships of Achilles and Ajax are located respectively at the upper left and the upper right tips of the U, at the northwest and northeast. To be highlighted here is a detail about the ship of Odysseus: the king Agamemnon is shown standing on the deck of this beached ship, which is said to be located en messatōi ‘in the middlemost space’, I.08.223, and from here this over-king projects his voice of royal authority, shouting mightily to all the Achaeans stationed at their own ships, I.08.227. Correspondingly, all the Achaeans stationed at all the beached ships can hear the king’s voice—from the ship of Achilles at one extreme of the U-shaped bay all the way to the ship of Ajax at the other extreme, I.08.224–226 (HPC 160–161). Agamemnon’s own beached ship, together with the ships of Diomedes and Nestor, is located near the ship of Odysseus, and it is in this ‘middlemost space’ of the U-shaped bayline that the central station of the Achaeans is visualized by the narrative, I.08.223. In the later comments at I.11.005–016, I.11.806–808, and I.14.027–036, there will be more to say about the locations of all these beached ships. To be highlighted already now, however, is the general reference to the klisiai or ‘shelters’ here at I.08.220, which are the abodes of the heroes. Then at I.08.224 the same word klisiai refers specifically to the abodes of Achilles and Ajax, mentioned at I.08.224–225. The description here shows that the klisiai ‘shelters’ of these two heroes are pointedly aligned with their beached ships. As for the ships beached at the middle of the bayline in the south, they mark a political and sacral centerpoint for the Achaeans. The evidence for the preceding formulation will be presented in the comment on I.11.806–808.

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By blaming or insulting his fellow Achaeans for not daring to stand up to the onslaught of Hector, Agamemnon is goading them into action. His insulting words recall a scene that took place in their collective epic past, on the island of Lemnos, where the Achaeans were competitively boasting about the exploits they will perform in the future when they fight in the Trojan War. The idea of ‘boasting’ is conveyed by the noun eukhōlē, which is derived from eukhesthai ‘declare’. As we already saw at I.01.091, what is at stake when an Achaean hero boasts in the Iliad centers on the all-important question: who is the ‘best of the Achaeans’? The noun eukhōlai ‘boastings’ in the plural here at I.08.229 indicates a distributive action: the Achaeans were boasting not as a group but individually and competitively. The object of such competition and dispute would have been: to show who is the aristos ‘best’ of them all. When Agamemnon says at I.08.229 ‘we were saying that we were best [aristoi]’, the plural construction here is distributive in meaning: ‘each one of us was saying that he was the best [aristos]’. We see in this scene of a past event at Lemnos an epic precedent for what is ongoing in the present time of the Trojan War as narrated in the Iliad. Just as there was a dispute at Lemnos, there is a dispute ongoing in the Iliad about that all-important question: who is the ‘best of the Achaeans’? A most relevant detail in the story about the dispute at Lemnos is the fact that the context for the quarreling that took place at that time over the same question, who is the ‘best of the Achaeans’, was a feast where meat was being distributed, I.08.231. So the setting for the quarrel was an event that is elsewhere called a dais, to be defined as ‘feast, division of portions (of meat); sacrifice’ in Homeric diction. As we saw in the comment for I.01.423–425, a dais is a feast where meat is distributed, and this meat comes from the sacrifice of a sacrificial animal. Thus the act of sacrifice converts the feast of humans into a notional feast of the gods. This notion, ‘feast of the gods’, is made explicit in the “micro-Iliad” of O.8.072–083, which is the First Song of Demodokos. At O.08.076, the setting is described this way: θεῶν ἐν δαιτὶ θαλείῃ ‘at a sumptuous feast [dais] of the gods’. So, what is happening at this feast? There is a dispute going on (δηρίσαντο at Ο.08.076), and the dispute is called a neikos ‘quarrel’ at O.08.075. The disputants are Odysseus and Achilles, who are described at O.08.078 as ‘the best of the Achaeans’. In terms of such a dispute in the context of a feast, each one of the two heroes would be claiming to be the ‘best of the Achaeans’. Similarly in the context of the feast at Lemnos as narrated by Agamemnon, each one of the heroes attending would be making such a claim.

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At the moment of his death here, the hero’s menos ‘mental power’ is released from his body, and, in the present context, the noun psūkhē ‘spirit’ is used as a synonym of menos.

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The verb haptesthai ‘grab a hold of’ here at I.08.339 has as its subject a hunting dog that bites and as its object the animal that is bitten by the dog, as we see at I.08.338. In other contexts, to be cited in the comment on O.10.379, the same verb can be metaphorized with reference to the language.

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The noun aethlos (āthlos) ‘ordeal’ in the plural, aethloi, programmatically refers to the Labors of Hēraklēs. These aethloi ‘ordeals’ were life-and-death struggles imposed on the hero by Eurystheus, who was socially superior to him but inferior otherwise.

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The constellation of words linked with pulē in the sense of ‘gate’, such as pul-artēs ‘gate-closer’ here (genitive πυλάρταο), is linked with the idea of the pulai ‘gates’ of Hādēs. See the comments on I.05.395–404, I.05.646, I.11.671; see also Points 5 and 6 in the anchor comment at I.23.071–076.

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The very idea of exposing a dead body to be eaten by dogs and birds, as conjured here at I.08.379–380, is considered to be an abomination in the Iliad, by contrast with the ritually correct practice of cremation. See the comment on I.01.003–005.

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The cosmic river Ōkeanos, encircling the known world, is a boundary delimiting light from darkness, wakefulness from sleep, life from death. The sun rises from the Ōkeanos at sunrise, just as it sets into it at sunset. At I.07.421–423 we saw sunrise; now at I.08.485–486 we see sunset.

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lemmatizing: ἔλπομαι εὐχόμενος vs. εὔχομαι ἐλπόμενος

Aristarchus debated with Zenodotus of Ephesus (the debate is indicated by way of the sign ⸖ in front of the verse), who attested the variant ἔλπομαι εὐχόμενος. (On the readings of Zenodotus as opposed by Aristarchus, see under Zenodotus and under Aristarchus in the inventory of Words and Ideas.) Aristarchus preferred the variant εὔχομαι ἐλπόμενος, which has been transmitted in the medieval manuscript tradition. As Muellner 1976:58-62 shows, both variants can be justified on the basis of analyzing the formulaic system of Homeric diction.

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The words spoken by Hector here reveal an overweening desire to be an immortal god, not a mortal human. By speaking this way, the hero is challenging the cosmic order.

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Here is a working translation: ‘If only I |539 could be immortal and unaging for all days to come, |540 and if only I could be honored [tiesthai] just as Athena and Apollo are honored, |541 —as surely as this day brings misfortune to the Argives’ (εἰ γὰρ ἐγὼν ὣς |539 εἴην ἀθάνατος καὶ ἀγήρως ἤματα πάντα |540 τιοίμην δ’ ὡς τίετ’ Ἀθηναίη καὶ Ἀπόλλων, |541 ὡς νῦν ἡμέρη ἥδε κακὸν φέρει Ἀργείοισι). Hector’s aspiration to become immortal and ageless and to receive the same honors as received by the divinities Athena and Apollo, I.08.538–540, is worded in such a way as to invite a cosmic sanction. On the syntax of the wording, see the comment on I.18.464–466. Hector’s wording here is especially dangerous because it would be provocative to Athena, who figures as this hero’s divine antagonist: see the comment on I.06.286–311.

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Leonard Muellner

in a list of passages exemplifying the complementary metrical distribution of eukhos and kudos

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analysis of kēla theoio (as at I.01.053), here, through comparison with puri kēleōi

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in a list of instances where phanai substitutes for eukhesthai where it is combined with comparative/superlative

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analysis of kēla theoio (as at I.01.053), here, through comparison with puri kēleōi

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in a list of passages exemplifying the complementary metrical distribution of eukhos and kudos

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in a list of examples of directly quoted prayers not concluded by formula (A)

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one of Corlu’s examples of eukhesthai referring to past actions

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analysis of kephalē as synonym for the whole person (this line as example)

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analysis of the variant prologue to the Iliad connecting the mēnis of Achilles and of Apollo and the parallels in its diction to this line

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analysis of the third person references to oneself by a speaker in Iliad

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analysis of I.08.526 and its variant reading (with elpomai eukhomenos) of Zenodotus and the problems of each of the readings

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analysis of I.08.526 and its variant reading (with elpomai eukhomenos) of Zenodotus and the problems of each of the readings

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in a list of examples of eukhesthai + infinitive (future)

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reference to Hector’s godhead, in the context of analyzing I.07.298 (sacral eukhesthai + dative where its antecedent is not a god)

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Richard Martin

The command that Zeus addresses through Iris to Hera and Athena at 8.399-408 is characteristic of the way his muthoi combine several types of speech-act: directives blend with explicit threats. Hera and Athena are told to turn back; if they do not, Zeus will lame their horses, cast them out, and wreck the chariot (8.402-3). Furthermore, at the conclusion of this command, Zeus sets exact limitations on the action: Hera he will not berate as much as Athena, seeing that she is an inveterate adversary. Zeus' power to command is thus matched by his power to create nuance and give verbal texture to his directives—he is a master at the poetics of power. Zeus' commands, through Iris, occur at a problem that arises in framing: the words of Iris to Hera and Athena are described as a threat (ēpeilēse, 8.415), but have been introduced by Zeus with a line appropriate to a prediction (8.401, "Thus I will speak out and it will be completed"). Since in speech-act theory predictions are constatives and commands are directives, this correlation appears puzzling. But Zeus' language transcends human speech categories: in the language of Zeus, commands, threats, and predictions comprise one and the same category, making Zeus supreme (Martin 1993:52-53).

For the ideal of Zeus' muthos commands, see the comment on Iliad 8.5-27.

References

Martin, R. P. 1993. The Language of Heroes: Speech and Performance in the Iliad. Ithaca.

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